Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#61

Post by cyberge99 » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:40 PM UTC

fredsted wrote: post #18

As businesses start to realize microservices aren't really worth it due to the complexity and cost it entails, they will start reverting back to hosting monoliths on VMs or services like Heroku/Netlify/Laravel Forge/Beanstalk, and they'll find out they can save a lot of money on compute and man hours by doing this. For more simple workflows, e.g. a single API endpoint, there's serverless and other SaaS services out t…

No sane business is saving money with Heroku. It offers zero mid or back tier flexibility. PaaS and serverless are here to stay.

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#62

Post by kall » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:42 PM UTC

thinkingkong wrote: post #12

The new thing thats going to “emerge” is already here. VMs and Containers were around for about a decade or more before they became really widespread. Frankly I think the serverless model will end up dominating in the long run. Whats really missing there isnt a better abstraction for k8s. Its the dx workflow and local development experience that still requires lots of work. Emulators for services, workflows, good ide…

I think as long as we are emulating the cloud runtime and services it will not reach it‘s full potential.

Developers need to be able to run the real platform, like they can with k8s/k3s.

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#63

Post by bespoke_engnr » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:46 PM UTC

torvald wrote: post #25

I very much hope to see Hashicorp Nomad getting more traction, as a simpler, yet feature rich solution to probably most use cases in our industry. Pretty interesting to see the adoption of podman and also micro-vms (like fly.io does it), and other Nomad providers that does not nessasarly need to be docker. I know there are great terraform modules out there already, but i wonder if many of Hashicorp's products soon wi…

If anyone wants to test nomad/consul on AWS, and you just want to type 'terraform apply' and then have a consul cluster, nomad cluster, and example app to play around with: https://github.com/groovemonkey/tutorialinux-hashistack/

It's a work in progress but might be helpful to someone!

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#64

Post by tluyben2 » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:51 PM UTC

Simpler solutions that behave the same on your laptop as it does on a cloud setup. More Heroku like. Most people / companies don't need all the intricate settings of Kubernetes (or docker). You basically want to have a docker-compose file, put some cpu, mem, scaling, replication numbers and that's it. Deploy locally or on a cluster and it'll just work, scaling as you go, if available on your deployed platform.

I know this is already possible, but it's not very easy, especially across laptop, cloud and baremetal; Kubernetes on baremetal is a pain (no simple ingress if you don't have access to the router or loadbalancing).

I hope someone tells me this exists but I tried a lot of solutions and they all fail at something (complexity / dependency on big cloud providers / dependency on specific network capabilities etc).

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#65

Post by kall » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:53 PM UTC

atom_arranger wrote: post #16

Infrastructure as code. One way to do it is you have semi-imperative code that runs, the output of the code is a description of the system to be deployed. Then you have some kind of diffing system that figures out how to take your existing cloud deployment and turn it into the new version described by the output of your code. This is how Pulumi works for example.

Something I am waiting for is a cloud platform that competes with AWS/GCP/Azure where IaC is the only way to access it.

No dashboard where you can muck about, no shared account that mixes together resources from all your environments, no messy state managment errors because you are always working with the same state: the truth of what is running right now.

The console would only be for monitoring, observability and maybe some disaster recovery actions.

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#66

Post by blacktriangle » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:54 PM UTC

cyberge99 wrote: post #61

fredsted wrote: post #18

As businesses start to realize microservices aren't really worth it due to the complexity and cost it entails, they will start reverting back to hosting monoliths on VMs or services like Heroku/Netlify/Laravel Forge/Beanstalk, and they'll find out they can save a lot of money on compute and man hours by doing this. For more simple workflows, e.g. a single API endpoint, there's serverless and other SaaS services out t…

No sane business is saving money with Heroku. It offers zero mid or back tier flexibility. PaaS and serverless are here to stay.

Heroku savings come in your payroll, not your monthly hardware budget.

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#67

Post by nwsm » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:56 PM UTC

buffet_overflow wrote: post #23

corobo wrote: post #7

I think Kubernetes will be a part of things (as Docker still is) but it'll be the next level of abstraction -- the thing that turns Kubernetes into Heroku. There's been a few popping up recently, time will tell who wins

What have you seen in that space so far?

Knative is the obvious first answer.

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#68

Post by stepbeek » Fri, May 14, 2021, 4:59 PM UTC

tluyben2 wrote: post #64

Simpler solutions that behave the same on your laptop as it does on a cloud setup. More Heroku like. Most people / companies don't need all the intricate settings of Kubernetes (or docker). You basically want to have a docker-compose file, put some cpu, mem, scaling, replication numbers and that's it. Deploy locally or on a cluster and it'll just work, scaling as you go, if available on your deployed platform. I know…

Docker Swarm was closer to this but never really got the traction to become a serious contender. I really liked being able to use a compose-like file to deploy. It had a much smaller feature set than k8s and some gotchas, but I felt like it was a lot easier to grok than k8s.

The thing that led to my moving away from it was the lack of a mainstream hosted version.

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#69

Post by geggam » Fri, May 14, 2021, 5:00 PM UTC

lanstin wrote: post #60

geggam wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... and my skills are getting used to fix the issues that folks dont understand when these layers break Keep building those layers... thats job security

And strace and tcpdump (and now perf and friends) can still fix almost any problem with access to the source and enough thought.

add sysdig to your tool box

Re: Ask HN: What do you think will come after Kubernetes?

#70

Post by jimbob45 » Fri, May 14, 2021, 5:03 PM UTC

fredsted wrote: post #18

As businesses start to realize microservices aren't really worth it due to the complexity and cost it entails, they will start reverting back to hosting monoliths on VMs or services like Heroku/Netlify/Laravel Forge/Beanstalk, and they'll find out they can save a lot of money on compute and man hours by doing this. For more simple workflows, e.g. a single API endpoint, there's serverless and other SaaS services out t…

Microservices are worth it, just not for every use case. It sounds like you're blaming Google for misleading PMs into using something they didn't need. However, Google made a great product for those who need it. It's not google's fault that PMs love cargo-culting.