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Ask HN: "Is that work?"

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Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#61
My boss has the tremendous habit (when he is actually in the dealership), of coming into the office and looking straight at my screen, with the now dreaded words, "Is that work?", usually followed by "Come on [throwaway_burn]! Focus! Get some fucking work done!"

"I am getting fucking work done, Larry. This right here is work. Unless you know how to code a script to get the data this site needs from our web servers with no documentation, then this is how I know to solve that problem. Did you still want it solved or has something changed?"

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#62
post #28

I'm not sure if you're setting expectations with him. I have this problem to some extent. Some of our guys email around everyone telling them what they're doing, asking questions, trying to get feedback from everyone else. Others have clammed up, don't talk, shut themselves in. When the guys that talk about what they're doing (and some of it is weird obscure stuff, so they kindly abstract it) then you know they've be…

"Also your 20 days holiday is below the legal minimum." No, as pointed out above, 20 days holiday, on top of 8 public holidays, is the legal minimum.

Apparently the business closes for 4 days on Christmas which counts against their vacation time. That might not be legal.

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#63
post #57
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dmitri speaks the truth. I'm in the process of joining a company after meeting one of the founders at his meetup last month (White Bear Yard). At £17k, you could be doing better driving a bus in London.

Except that in order to live somewhere he could afford on a London bus-driver's salary, he'd need to be somewhere awful (actually, I don't know whether London has awful-and-cheap bits these days) or way out of town with a horrible commute. None the less: yes, there are more and better jobs in cities. There's also more competition for those jobs, though. I'll hazard a guess that although there's a lot of unemployment…

You can get a good room in Dalston for £500 a month, starting salary should be from £25k and up.

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#64
Here is the best advice I can give you knowing nothing about you outside of work:

#1 Take a day and get some fresh air before winter hits. Go on a hike - spend at least 4 hours by yourself on the trail. Imagine the perfect (reasonable) life - where do you live, who is there with you, what do you do each day?

#2 Can you plot a line from where you are right now to where you want to be? If you still want to do development, can you use what you are currently doing as part of a portfolio to show future employers? Do you have a portfolio of your work? Spend the next two weeks at work taking screenshots, making notes, etc, of EVERYTHING you've done at the company for the last two years. You don't know what you'll want later, and if it is internal or changed you won't be able to get it when you want it. Remember that ticketing system you made? Screenshots of that too, especially if that recognizable company's name is on it. If it's not on it, put it on it, then take another screenshot.

#3 You say you don't have mobility in terms of changing jobs. Why is that? Experience, education, geography? Can you stomach moving if you got a better job offer? What salary would you move for? You have no degree - how would your prospects differ if you had one? How old are you now and when will you retire? Is it worth working part-time, schooling full-time to earn the degree in order to have 30+ years of increased happiness?

#4 You don't want to be seen as a cost (of course not, it is like saying what you do is not important to the company or team). It sounds like your boss outsourced your efforts to another firm and he made a profit from it. It is easy to look at this like you're being taken advantage of - but look at it another way - this is your opportunity to move from "cost" to "pays for himself" to "profit making." Tell your boss to find two more of those outsource gigs for other dealers and he will start thinking about you differently because he will be able to directly measure your output.

#5 When you do start to look for the next job, think about how those new jobs work for their companies. If you're making websites and you work for a hospital, you're a "cost" again. If you make websites and work for a company that makes websites... it is a little different. In your next job try to find a position where you work with other technical people. It can be really hard to be the lone technical person in an office (just like I'm sure the graphic designer can have a hard time being the lone designer). Spend time now working on your resume, don't wait until you see a job listing you want or meet the right person. You need to have it ready so at any time you can send it out (so you're not in a rush and make errors).

Ok, here is the summary:

#1 Fresh air, introspection.

#2 Build your portfolio. Be able to prove to a non-technical person that you have been doing something for the last two years (besides taking a paycheck).

#3 Set your goals, identify obstacles and solutions. Be flexible and open minded to your options.

#4 Find ways your boss can directly measure your performance in ways that matter to him.

#5 Be prepared for the next opportunity. Keep your resume up-to-date. Start today.

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#65
Have you tried taking control of his perception of your working day? I've had bosses in the past where the only way to manage them and their expectations was to maintain a narrative of what you were up to.

Perhaps you could schedule a weekly (daily) catch-up with your boss to explain what you're doing, any issues you've had etc. If he won't commit the time to sit down with you, email him a bulleted list of what you're doing that week/day. Don't get lost in the detail but try to highlight any particular wins (e.g. "the database server we'll need for the quotation site is up and running") and any particular roadblocks ("[web services firm] haven't sent the documentation through I requested. I've scheduled a call for Monday to try and get it sent"). If you're not making the progress you expected/hoped for, always present it in a positive light by explaining what you're doing to deal with it.

If he is always coming to you to find out what you're doing, it might be that he's doing it at the wrong time for him (when he's dealt with all his crises and is tired/stressed) or for you (when you're having a short HN-break in which case you appear to be 'always' slacking).

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#66

Can you move your desk to somewhere else, somewhere where your boss won't visit often?

If the boss thinks you're goofing off, moving your desk will look like trying to sneak off and goof off more.

Yes. Or he might just forget about it altogether.

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#67
Quit. Now.

This environment is noxious to your mental health, your sense of self-worth, your ability to get decent work in the future, and so on.

Quit. Now.

After you've handed in your notice, and they're exploding into fireworks of anger and "I can't believe this shit"-ness, tell them politely that you're available for consulting work with them over the weekends if they need help with the systems you've built for them, at a reasonable rate of £200/day.

Then go look for another job. You'll find one. IT staff are always in demand. If there really are no jobs where you live, move.

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#68

> Some statistics recently suggested that a snowball had a better chance of opening an ice cream shop in the deepest layer of hell than I have of getting another job. You could not be more wrong. I organise the London Hacker News meetup and speak weekly to people who are DESPERATE to get a good developer. Unemployment may well be high, but there is huge demand for good developers. Unless you have very strong ties to…

According to the BBC, In the city I live, there is around 8 unemployed people for every 1 job here. I'd love to work/live in London, but I am a bit nervous about getting down there because I don't have a degree. I'm completely self taught.

You have something better than a degree, you have work experience. I really wouldn't be worried about the number of unemployed people around - you have specialized skills that are in demand and most of them don't. It may be that they'll all try to apply to any job they see, making the matching of jobs to candidates harder for all concerned but I really wouldn't worry about it too much.

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#69
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll be in touch. (And I'm from Wales).

this made me happy :) It's proof positive again of why I love HN. I read and felt for you with your post then in no time, you may have found a light at the end of the tunnel. Great news :D I can't wait to hear that it's worked out for you!

He wasn't offering him a job, I don't think :P

Re: Ask HN: "Is that work?"

#70
I'm talking to this guy on IRC right now.

"Thanks for all the responses! Unfortunately it looks like HN thinks I was replying too fast, and I am now blocked from posting new comments. I will continue to read replies though, thanks."

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