Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#61

Post by unit91 » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 5:50 PM UTC

samstave wrote: post #22

> I'm 40 years old without any children and would like to be able to not be stressed and work overtime and solve hard technical problems You have no kids... You can work overtime and do anything you want when you want with respect to working and focusing on work without kids. I'll assume those downvoting this comment dont have kids.

I have kids and down-voted your comment. Simply because a person has (or might have) the capacity for working overtime doesn't mean this should be a requirement. We're employees, not slaves.

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#62

Post by matt_the_bass » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 5:52 PM UTC

platz wrote: post #3

matt_the_bass wrote: post #2

I think these jobs exist. Mine does. We’re a small company that makes high value physical items with a large software component. We encourage remote working but not remote only. I know this is not a popular view on HN, but I think there is huge value with regular irl interaction. It doesn’t need to be every day, but it does need to be regular. We also offer mostly single person offices (interns are currently 2 per ro…

What does a rut look like, like what is the last recent tech rut folks use. And what is an example of tech that non-rut folks have that rut folks don't have?

Great question. IMHO the ruts we are trying to avoid are sticking only to a previously used solution because of the fear of trying new things. Of course that needs to be balanced with the risks/costs of trying new things too.

As a mentioned previously we’ve found a lot of senior sw candidates who have 20+ years experience working on a huge legacy technology in a huge beaurocratic organization. Some of those people have no problem applying their experience and skills to general software engineering efforts. However others are only fluent and comfortable in that one legacy technology and are not really experienced in the fundamentals. A surprising number of those people exist. That’s who we want to avoid.

Skills we do want are: ability to apply fundamentals to general solutions, ability to consider the costs of various approaches, ability to plan and architect, ability to organize well, ability to communicate well, ability to learn, etc.

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#63

Post by Yenderman » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 5:52 PM UTC

It doesn't match all of your wants, but you should consider living in the inner city of a large metropolitan area and working for tech companies there. In Los Angeles, a talented dev/arch with devops can make $185,000/yr with benefits. Another possibility would be turning into a migrant fruit-picker, stick your stuff in a storage facility and follow the contracts around the country, looking for the $200/hr gigs.

Do all of the above, then retire early and spend your time developing your own client list at your own pace at home, working 0 to 10 hours per week.

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#64

Post by elteto » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 5:52 PM UTC

tyrust wrote: post #30

connoredel wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure he meant "freshman or freshwoman"

Oh, didn't think of that. I hope that's the case. Avoiding a gendered word would avoid this confusion.

Not jumping to conclusions would have been equally acceptable.

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#65

Post by matt_the_bass » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 5:53 PM UTC

wai1234 wrote: post #10

matt_the_bass wrote: post #2

I think these jobs exist. Mine does. We’re a small company that makes high value physical items with a large software component. We encourage remote working but not remote only. I know this is not a popular view on HN, but I think there is huge value with regular irl interaction. It doesn’t need to be every day, but it does need to be regular. We also offer mostly single person offices (interns are currently 2 per ro…

"My only concern hiring older engineers is that they are stuck in a rut." Wow, better check that bias.

Please see my other replies for further clarification. Note you’ve assumed that I’m not an older engineer myself. Perhaps that is your bias :)

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#66

Post by codingdave » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 5:54 PM UTC

Those types of jobs exist, but usually not with young companies. Look for older, established companies that either have high internal tech needs, or are a tech-based business.

I had 2 jobs that matched your description, each of which lasted 5 years - one was internal software development for a large energy company. The other was working for a small SaaS shop that had been around for more than 10 years.

On the flip side, the least satisfying jobs I've had were open-office startups with inexperienced managers and CEOs. I didn't last a year at the three of those I've done, and I think I've finally learned my lesson to never try again.

To be clear, there is a place in this industry for young startups led by ambitious but inexperienced leadership teams. I think positively of the people from those places and wish them well... I just agree that those of us who have been around this block for more than a couple decades don't fit well in such places.

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#67

Post by wisam » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 6:01 PM UTC

illumin8 wrote: post #44

jvagner wrote: post #19

The bigger companies I worked for in the Bay Area were more like this than the smaller. As a late 40-something who started his own marketing & technology agency to get out of the "working for others and their bad boss habits" conundrum, the one thing I can strongly recommend is that you have to interview companies as carefully as they interview you. I've directly hired more than 100 people in my career, and it was al…

I'm a 44 year old senior engineer, and the one thing I've noticed is that bad managers are almost universal in technology. I've had about 20 managers in my career and I can count only 2-3 that I would consider great managers, the rest ranged from mediocre to incredibly incompetent. This, to me, is the #1 reason I gain much more satisfaction from doing consulting work on the side: I'm my own manager, and I can make de…

Why do think is the reason that most managers in technology are bad? I tend to think of management as abstraction. A mid-level manager provides an abstraction of the work for high-level management and at the same time is provided an abstraction of the work by the low-level managers or engineers. Assuming that my understanding is right, are these abstractions leaky? is the lack of technical knowledge the reason why managers are bad?

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#68

Post by jensv » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 6:01 PM UTC

Yenderman wrote: post #56

When I was 30, people just looked at me and assumed I was a competent software engineer because I looked exactly like a very senior software engineer, and I presented myself in that way. But I was very junior, having made a recent career change. Yet they paid me like a prince, and I rose so rapidly through the ranks that I became an executive. Now I'm 50, and my company folded and I went to the curb, and am looking f…

That's insanity. What is wrong with this industry????

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#69

Post by WalterSear » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 6:02 PM UTC

platz wrote: post #54

WalterSear wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At a large, well known software company, I worked with senior engineers, with a decade's more development experience than I, who couldn't use React properly, or even understand Redux. These are not difficult tools. They had been working on the specific codebase for over a year, fwiw.

They should learn to use React & understand Redux

They should be reading the fucking source code. Redux isn't big. But they are stuck in a rut.

IMHO, from the outside, senior developer rut looks like a fear/resistance to change or learning. I'm not sure if what is really going on inside, though. Probably career burnout.

I am the around same age as the guys I'm referring to here, fwiw. So, it's more than just physiological aging.

Re: Ask HN: 40+ Career Advice?

#70

Post by deanmoriarty » Sat, Oct 13, 2018, 6:03 PM UTC

liftbigweights wrote: post #52

Why not retire and contribute to open source? You can set your own schedule and speak to whomever you want or no one at all. It amazes me that people in their 40s are working as software developers. Did everyone gamble their money away? 20 years in software developement is easily a few million in the bank + retirement account + home. Why not retire?

This is harsh but true. I am an average 32 years old software engineer in the Bay Area, and in my average 8 years career I amassed roughly $1.2M by diligently saving, investing in index funds and living frugally.

My real hope is that by the time I’m in my mid 40s this amount, including the new savings, will have at least doubled (if not 3X), and I’ll be able to retire or take some very light job in a cheaper area, not worrying about this nonsense software engineering bias against age.