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Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

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51–60 of 193 posts

Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

#51
Congratulations! You literally built a company and now have what it takes to found your own.

I would vest in peace, learn from senior management (seems like your company hired good senior folks) cultivate relationships both in and out of the company (VC + advisors)... then start tinkering in your free time. Once your options vest you should be ready with an MVP and solid contacts to hit the ground running.

Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

#55

One thing you need to come to grips is that regardless of how smart you are, the VP of engineering is probably someone that has a lot more experience and clout than you do. If they aren't, then the senior management of the company is terrible. If your company has grown to the size of 40-50 people, that's the time when they need real experience to help drive them forward. They can't take a chance on a great programmer…

Why is it acceptable for the Founder/CEO to continue leading the company at 40+ employees but not acceptable for the engineer to lead an engineering team at 40+ employees? Seems like a double standard.

I understand, but you are right it's a double standard. The Founder/CEO usually got that position for reasons other than their their technical know how. Personally, If a CEO doesn't understand most of the nuts and bolts of the company they are running; bye! bye!(That is unless they are brilliant in other areas in business.)

Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

#56
This exact situation happened to me. If you are at such a distance from the founder that he doesn't care about your place in the company — namely you're not considered one of the "important people" — your problem is two-fold:

1. Your immediate job won't be as gratifying.

2. (And this is a bigger deal) You won't be in the room during the exit when the money is being handed out.

Re 1, as I saw it, given my equity stake, I should just put my head down and wait for the liquidity event. This worked well, though was a large blow to the ego. Given personalities and priorities of the founder, agitating would have put my equity stake at risk.

Re 2, despite the fact that you may have an iron clad equity stake, there is often money that is handed out in an exit which goes beyond equity. In my case it was about $90mil in retention money. If you're seen as one of the "important people", you'll be in the room when that is being divvied up and can get your hands in the cookie jar (at that point it's just a land grab.) If not, you're shit out of luck, since no one at that point will be looking out for your interests.

So, I would say I would take the long view and not worry too much about the ego/job satisfaction. If you end up set for life, the resentment will fade. (I'm 3 years post liquidity event and the resentment is for the most part gone. Both for the name on letterhead issue and being left out during retention.) I would, however, do all I could at this point to re-establish myself as one of the 'important people' so you can be in the room when the cookie jar is open. In my case, it was impossible since in my obviously biased view the founder was an ass and an idiot, but perhaps your situation is still salvageable.

Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

#57

One thing you need to come to grips is that regardless of how smart you are, the VP of engineering is probably someone that has a lot more experience and clout than you do. If they aren't, then the senior management of the company is terrible. If your company has grown to the size of 40-50 people, that's the time when they need real experience to help drive them forward. They can't take a chance on a great programmer…

Why is it acceptable for the Founder/CEO to continue leading the company at 40+ employees but not acceptable for the engineer to lead an engineering team at 40+ employees? Seems like a double standard.

Ownership has its privileges.

Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

#58

One thing you need to come to grips is that regardless of how smart you are, the VP of engineering is probably someone that has a lot more experience and clout than you do. If they aren't, then the senior management of the company is terrible. If your company has grown to the size of 40-50 people, that's the time when they need real experience to help drive them forward. They can't take a chance on a great programmer…

Why is it acceptable for the Founder/CEO to continue leading the company at 40+ employees but not acceptable for the engineer to lead an engineering team at 40+ employees? Seems like a double standard.

> Why is it acceptable for the Founder/CEO to continue leading the company at 40+ employees but not acceptable for the engineer to lead an engineering team at 40+ employees? Seems like a double standard.

It is a double standard, but however it's hardly that cut and dry.

Post Series B, if the board does not believe the current Founder/CEO can take the company to the next milestones of growth, they will replace them.

Typically engineering teams need to scale sooner, so you you see a more experienced manager be brought in before the CEO is considered for replacing.

The CEO may also has the additional benefit of having the investors and board help him or her in their decisions.

Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?

#59
Are you really young?

I would expect the first engineering employees to know the most about the stack and thus naturally become the engineering leadership as the team grows, which it sounds like you were. If they felt the need to hire above you, it sounds like you were lacking some cross-section of experience that the founders/board want. You should ask them.

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