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Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

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Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#51

Post by Taikonerd »

Taikonerd wrote: post #36

Most people are posting links to hardware, but in my mind, this is a software question. Maybe one of those BASIC interpreters with an integrated IDE, the way that QBASIC used to be on older Windows versions? QB64 is the modern equivalent: https://qb64.com/ Your kids won't literally need to navigate the command line to launch the games. But I think that editing config files to "hack" the game is still on the table :-)…

Responding to my own comment: maybe it does have to be separate hardware. If your kid is programming on the same computer they use for Fortnight, then whenever they lose momentum and get discouraged, they're going to be tempted to switch over and play a nice shiny AAA game instead. Or hop on social media, etc. Modern computers just have too many distractions at hand.

Having a separate computer just for the lo-fi programming environment won't fully prevent that, but at least it's a minor roadblock.

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#52

Post by Projectiboga »

ianseyler wrote: post #34

Kano - https://kano.tech/us/original Looks like their website has changed around. They used to have a kit that came with a raspberry pi (that you had to assemble yourself) and their own Linux-based OS that taught you about computers and the command line https://github.com/KanoComputing/kano-desktop https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/kano-computer-kit-touch...

It's still there, based on Raspberry Pi 3. The newer models are Intel based w Windows 10s. I'd preorder a Pi 5 and do a project w the kid where you source the pi, case, screen, get an old laptop or two a old router and set up a network lab.

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#53

Post by Projectiboga »

ianseyler wrote: post #45
SuperHeavy256 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their website redesign is so unintuitive.

Agreed. Not sure what the status of the company is either. Their GitHub repos have been quiet for years.

They ripped us off w a Kickstarter, three things first two came the supposed synth that they had Nile Rodgers pitch never shipped and they pivoted to their kid's software basically being a Windows app.

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#55

Post by hnbear »

I bought a Kano kit for my son (he was 9 or 10). I think they went under but it was a Pi 3 with a specific Linux based OS designed for learning.

It came in bits with very nice instructions for building it. Bright cables, easy Lego style diagrams. The keyboard is wireless with a built in track pad, and charges via a built in usb cable. All very neat and self contained.

We got to build a whole computer, plug it into the TV, and it behaves a bit like a console.

It has a mix of learn shell, basic programming and fun Linux games (including Minecraft). The whole OS includes a gamified points system too, to encourage more learning.

I think the OS is a free download, but you could easily get a Pi and some fun accessories and build something.

On my to-do list next is building a pi based motion sensor camera for the basement to see if we have mice. Part serious need, part fun game.

For a lot of things though he learns more left alone. Building iPad and iPhone games using some of the drag and drop gaming toolkit apps, for example. My parents had no idea what I did on the computer and couldn’t have helped. I taught myself. He likes that too

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#56

Post by Taikonerd »

em500 wrote: post #32

There is no a modern day equivalent. Not because of availibility of hardware or software (both better hardware and better software are widely available at trivial costs nowadays), but because the world around us has changed. Specifically, the experience needs to compete against the limitless other distractions from the internet. Here's a simple simulation of the 1980s experience: https://virtualconsoles.com/online-em…

This, unfortunately, is the truth.

But that begs the question: what are 11-year-old computer nerds doing now? Modding games? Building complicated machines in Minecraft?

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#57

Post by galfarragem »

jl6 wrote: post #26

I don’t think this experience is available any more. The missing ingredient is not the technology, but the motivation/reward. In the 80s/early 90s, fiddling with that system setup earned you an interactive audiovisual experience that you simply couldn’t get anywhere else, not even on TV. Today, there is very little that kids haven’t already seen on YouTube, or that can’t be played at the click of a button. It was an…

Hacking drones is still on early days with lots of low hanging fruit if you have time and nothing else to think about. However, it is an order of magnitude more dangerous than PCs were back in the 80s and parents may resist the idea.

In the 80s playing with software was more relevant than with hardware. Nowadays I believe it’s the opposite, trades were abandoned and are an huge oportunity.

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#58

Post by tshirttime »

Unplug the computer from the internet, hand the kid a UNIX manual, and suck all joy from computing.

Having a working browser teach you programming is like having an android in the form of Kelly LeBrock teach you robotics. You're gonna want to do things to it that engage your little brain.

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#59

Post by f1shy »

lolinder wrote: post #50
f1shy wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Parents as the driving force simply won’t work. I keep seeing that myth. Most of the people I know studies the same as their parents, inspired by them. Specially what catches in kids are hobbies. I have lots of friend which are professional or semi professional musicians. All of them got the playing of the instrument from the parents.

My wife's siblings are all musicians because that's the direction their mom drove, but nearly all of them now wish that they'd been allowed to pursue what they were truly interested in. If given a choice, only one of six would have chosen music as the primary thing in their life. Seeing that, my feeling isn't so much that parents as the driving force doesn't work, it's that it's cruel. Our kids are not blank slates f…

There is a difference between showing to start interest and shoving down the throat. I know both kinds.

Re: Ask HN: Whats the modern day equivalent of 80s computer for kids to explore?

#60

Post by kyriakos »

mcook08 wrote: post #18

I’m a Dad who grew up in the 80s and the problem is us, the parents. My parents didn’t push me to get into computing, I just found it fascinating. If we try to find things like gentle introductions, it’s likely to get more kids to a base level familiarity but all of the real learning was in reading a 256 page manual as an 8 year old so I could get StarCraft to work on my highly custom rig. Parents as the driving forc…

I am also a dad that grew up in the 80's and my thoughts on this issue is that back in those days there was a much smaller selection of things you could do with a computer, less stimuli and smaller need for instant gratification. At some point computers turned from being a tool you could create to a tool you use to consume other people's creations. From my experience, children today don't have enough patience to learn how to hack things around before they get bored and move on to the next thing. There amount of distractions is insane (web, social media, youtube, easily accessible video games etc). Its more likely a kid will avoid the problem than try to solve it at this point. I feel we lost something important along the way.
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