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Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

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Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#51

Post by mrieck »

simonsarris wrote: post #13
jrajav wrote: post #10

React is now the de facto choice and much less painful than past de facto choices, is my take on why. It has a mature and healthy ecosystem, and its relatively small surface makes it easy to learn and predictable, while declarative GUI in general is low on footguns compared to ye ol two-way data binding. Many of the competitors springing up define themselves in terms of React, either as an improvement or a foil. But…

haha, I basically feel this way about Svelte/Kit. It's not mature, but the surface is so small and learning curve so pleasant that it's our go to choice now for internal webapps. (We have no external webapps because my company, funny enough, builds a JavaScript framework!)

Doesn't sound like a very promising company if your own developers rather use a different framework than dogfood their own. Isn't that kind of admitting defeat?

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#52

Post by [deleted] »

steve_taylor wrote: post #36
simonsarris wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

haha, I basically feel this way about Svelte/Kit. It's not mature, but the surface is so small and learning curve so pleasant that it's our go to choice now for internal webapps. (We have no external webapps because my company, funny enough, builds a JavaScript framework!)

> not mature Svelte was first released in 2016 and has become bigger than its original creator, Rich Harris. It has quite a thriving ecosystem and a big community. The tooling around it is more mature than React's has ever been. > surface is so small I actually find the opposite to be true. React still has a relatively small API surface area. One-way data flow makes it easier to understand. However, a smaller surface…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#53

Post by v3ss0n »

steve_taylor wrote: post #36
simonsarris wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

haha, I basically feel this way about Svelte/Kit. It's not mature, but the surface is so small and learning curve so pleasant that it's our go to choice now for internal webapps. (We have no external webapps because my company, funny enough, builds a JavaScript framework!)

> not mature Svelte was first released in 2016 and has become bigger than its original creator, Rich Harris. It has quite a thriving ecosystem and a big community. The tooling around it is more mature than React's has ever been. > surface is so small I actually find the opposite to be true. React still has a relatively small API surface area. One-way data flow makes it easier to understand. However, a smaller surface…

This is wrong in so many levels. You need to learn useState,useEffects in react.

You only need to learn how to put {varName} in svelte.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#55

Post by pie_flavor »

Every JS framework I have ever seen hit the front page of HN was well-justified in its use-case, and contributed something meaningful to the state of the art. There are a few now and there were a few then. There was never a plague, just people who really love bemoaning plagues from positions that would not have interacted with them anyway.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#56

Post by asguy »

karaterobot wrote: post #50
simonsarris wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

haha, I basically feel this way about Svelte/Kit. It's not mature, but the surface is so small and learning curve so pleasant that it's our go to choice now for internal webapps. (We have no external webapps because my company, funny enough, builds a JavaScript framework!)

I'm not a web dev anymore, I stopped right around the time hooks became a thing in React, and while Svelte was an exciting technology no big players had adopted yet. In fact the last thing I did for my old job was a little make-work exploration to test whether Svelte was was ready for them to use in prime time. My conclusion was that it was remarkably slick and empowering, but was not ready yet due to the lack of eco…

> lack of ecosystem support

.. is the “Nobody Got Fired For Buying (IBM|Microsoft|Cisco)” for the 2020s

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#57

Post by hactually »

ramesh31 wrote: post #19

React won. Angular is officially deprecated, and the others are distant also-rans at this point. React Native has also almost completely taken over iOS development. Thank god we can all just agree on a baseline to work from finally.

Did react win? Or did it become the foundation for Next.js?

We're using Vue here and missed the memo about it being an also run :)

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#58

Post by hoofhearted »

ramesh31 wrote: post #19

React won. Angular is officially deprecated, and the others are distant also-rans at this point. React Native has also almost completely taken over iOS development. Thank god we can all just agree on a baseline to work from finally.

Google hasn’t updated the Angular 1 documentation since 2020.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#59

Post by camkego »

goodoldneon wrote: post #35
square_usual wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

React doesn't have a "relatively small surface" any more, because even the React team doesn't recommend that you use "just" React. It's all frameworks on top of React like Next or Remix, and those are more complex, have many involved concepts and come with footguns. I have seen many, many sites switch to Next and completely bungle it, making the user experience worse than it was before the change. (Of course, even Re…

You can still use just React. No one is forcing you to use Next or Remix

No one is forcing you, but the React docs say "If you want to build a new app or a new website fully with React, we recommend picking one of the React-powered frameworks popular in the community. Frameworks provide features that most apps and sites eventually need, including routing, data fetching, and generating HTML."

So, it going to be difficult to choose pure React with that kind of statement.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone else notice that HN isn’t full of JavaScript frameworks lately?

#60

Post by dimmke »

karaterobot wrote: post #50
simonsarris wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

haha, I basically feel this way about Svelte/Kit. It's not mature, but the surface is so small and learning curve so pleasant that it's our go to choice now for internal webapps. (We have no external webapps because my company, funny enough, builds a JavaScript framework!)

I'm not a web dev anymore, I stopped right around the time hooks became a thing in React, and while Svelte was an exciting technology no big players had adopted yet. In fact the last thing I did for my old job was a little make-work exploration to test whether Svelte was was ready for them to use in prime time. My conclusion was that it was remarkably slick and empowering, but was not ready yet due to the lack of eco…

I’ve been working with Svelte very heavily since November of last year. It’s been a real journey with Svelte and SvelteKit over the last 7 months, seeing things change rapidly. I think one of the coolest things is that it has galvanized frameworks to become SPA framework agnostic.

Like NextAuth.js -> Auth.js React Query -> Tanstack Query

So at the very least, I think we are probably headed towards a plurality where it is practical to use Vue, React, Svelte or Solid though I do hope Svelte “wins” in the end.

I have to say, I still don’t think it’s to the point where it can be foisted on a team of mediocre developers in some kind of enterprise setting. Some of the libraries that exist for SvelteKit that I consider super critical are very small and maintained by one or two people.

I recently took on some freelance work for the first time in like 6 years, just to work on another large SK codebase and saw a lot of the same problems I encountered approached differently. I think there’s some key things that need to make it into core still.

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