Earlier quoted context omitted.
On the upside, in the USA, if you can find that 'sweet spot' company that is paying well, good healthcare, and good time off, you can make bank without overworking. I'm sure these exist all around the world, but perhaps they could be more common in the USA when compared to the EU, given the generally lower EU net wages we're talking about.
Its seems the obvious thing do is build a career in the US and half retire in a foreign country with good free healthcare and affordable rent. Rent out the american real estate bought over the course of the career and have that income pay for the European rent(which in my experience seems much lower).
Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
51–60 of 974 posts
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#52Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#53I've noticed from recruiter email that some US companies have decided to go fully remote (no doubt due to COVID-19) and have started looking for talent in Canada, offering a bit more compensation than our local one (not parity) so I expect this effect will start pushing salaries up outside the US, starting with us in Canada due to time zone/language/culture.
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#54One option is to emigrate to the United States, driving up pressure on the engineers who remain. My near-term ancestors all left Germany due to poor wages and a tendency for Bismarck to sacrifice draft-age men in wars, and while moving to the US helped their own status it also did a bit to increase pressure at home.
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#55The thing is, I just can’t find an argument why I should be able to get very rich doing my job. It’s a comfortable job. It pays a good salary. I got here by taking no risk at all. I wouldn’t want to switch jobs just to drive up my pay even if I could. I have other things to think about. I have worked 20 years in the same job and so have my colleagues. This is a cultural difference I feel.
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#56You see low salaries, I see more salary equality between engineers and non engineers. Most engineers don't add that much more value than other people in the company to justify earning 2x or more.
At an engineering firm? Seriously?
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#57It’s how Silicon Valley reached those salaries after all...
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#58Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#59Admittedly I don't know much about work relations in Europe but are SW engineers unionized there? A union could 1.)allow workers to aggressively collectively bargain for more money 2.)add additional requirements (licensure, education requirements, etc) to keep down the supply of labor. I'm not saying such a move would be good for everyone, but it could be good for those who become members of the union.
In Sweden a significant portion of tech workers are unionized. It doesn't work well for creating leverage in term of wages though. If anything, the impression I got at my last job where I was in the union was that the union negotiations mostly created an excuse for not increasing individual pay. "Sure, you perform really great and all, but if we give you more we'll have to reduce pay for someone else based on the agr…
You do give up some agency by going through intermediaries.
Good thing you are not forced to stay
Re: Ask HN: How to increase SWE salaries in Europe?
#60Just like anything worthwhile is done: through free market competition. Build a successful startup, make some nice money and attract the best in the business to work for you by making them eye-popping offers. This will make your competitors react by raising their pay and with it the whole market. It’s how Silicon Valley reached those salaries after all...
Dont know where to begin unpacking the falsehood of this. Maybe a counter question serves best: how is non-competitive behavior not worthwhile?