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Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

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Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#51

Post by chrisdsaldivar »

Just yesterday my mom called me asking me to check the logged in devices list on her email. She hasn’t been able to login and found out it had been hacked so she had to reset her password. I logged all the devices out and finally got her to stop using her last name as her password and we changed all of her passwords.

So, after years of my sister and me trying to get her to have proper passwords it took her getting hacked and seeing a bunch of failed spam emails to finally change her passwords. Maybe people reading this could “hack” their parents themselves so they could take security seriously. Yeah it’s lying but it’s safer than letting it happen organically.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#53

Post by lostlogin »

shuckles wrote: post #46

Similar to how I’d protect young children: get them an iPad, pre-install essential apps, whitelist some web domains, and require your authorization for any new app installs or domain whitelisting. You’ll find that their web browsing actually is limited to a few domains, and they should never learn to bank, etc. outside the apps.

Thanks - good idea. Adding in a Pihole has been good for me - keeps the ads and pop ups to a minimum.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#54

Post by nitwit005 »

agf wrote: post #21

The number one thing you can do to help them is talk to them about being conned / scammed. That's by far the most likely way for them to get victimized online, and the only way that's seriously affected anyone I know. Since they're not technical, their natural self-defense against this kind of this has trouble functioning online. Talk to them about real world analogs to pop-up ads that look like virus scanner alerts,…

Based on my father and grandmother's interactions, suggesting they call if ever in doubt can be a big help. What saved her from the fake Microsoft support scam was her calling him to ask if she should go to someone cheaper to help with the non-existant issue.

Offering to do her taxes prevented some other scam. Although that did require flying out annually due to being so disorganized.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#55

Post by dontbenebby »

djhworld wrote: post #47

I'm really surprised at the replies in this thread, some are almost patronising. Parents might be old, but they're not dumb. People underestimate older people. Obviously there are some vulnerable adults that need a helping hand, I get that, but try just talking and teaching, it works wonders. The key is patience really.

>Parents might be old, but they're not dumb. People underestimate older people.

They aren't dumb, but many in that generation are willfully ignorant.

There was a great article in the NYT recently titled "Why high class people get away with incompetence":

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/20/science/social-class-conf...

If you've gone your entire life being able to bluster away criticism or force someone to do things for you ("delegate"), it can lead to a type of person who is not teachable, and when they inevitably suffer a breach will blame everyone but themselves.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#56

Post by lostlogin »

beenBoutIT wrote: post #29
estsauver wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, it's still definitely considered one of the most secure consumer platforms both in fundamentals and in the practice of the number of bugs it's had. No security is perfect, a small handful of bugs over the last so-many years is about as good as any platform can hope for. If you're a CIA agent or run a bitcoin exchange it might not be good enough for you, but for most people it's a pretty good set of options.

ChromeOS is more secure and far less expensive than MacOS, although as long as you keep your parents off of Windows you won't have to worry about ransomware.

OP is discussing iOS. MacOS is free. Google hardware is definitely less expensive than Apple’s though.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#57

Post by dontbenebby »

johnchristopher wrote: post #49
djhworld wrote: post #47

I'm really surprised at the replies in this thread, some are almost patronising. Parents might be old, but they're not dumb. People underestimate older people. Obviously there are some vulnerable adults that need a helping hand, I get that, but try just talking and teaching, it works wonders. The key is patience really.

Yeah, well. A colleague of mine is an historian, in her early 50's I think. For three years now she has been taking notes in her small notepad of the four same shortcuts: ctrl-A, alt-tab, etc. She still doesn't get attachments and doesn't understand the differences between a zip file and a folder (I blame windows but still...). I think she's good at her job (research and producing articles) but she isn't catching up…

I think part of the problem is rote memorization rather than learning concepts.

(Eg: maybe if someone learns about the context of a "task switcher" and "shortcut" they could be taught how to search for 'task switcher shortcut windows'.

Instead we train users to treat keyboard shortcuts like magical incantations. I don't think that does a service to users of any age.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#58

Post by wittedhaddock »

I work for a phone company, Community Phone, whose majority customers are seniors. We periodically check in with our customers over text message (helping make sure they achieve their goals, like using Uber, or whatever... which is our business: to enable an improvement in overall quality of life via phones, rather than phones in themselves). As a result, many of our customers FB message/call/email/text us as a sanity check any time they receive solicitation online. It's a service we happily provide, but it does require them to reach out to us, as opposed to us knowing when to intervene. Other than that, I will be monitoring this thread very closely for more general and automated solutions. Thanks very much for asking this question.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#59

Post by rossdavidh »

djhworld wrote: post #47

I'm really surprised at the replies in this thread, some are almost patronising. Parents might be old, but they're not dumb. People underestimate older people. Obviously there are some vulnerable adults that need a helping hand, I get that, but try just talking and teaching, it works wonders. The key is patience really.

Just because they have problems with computers and computer-mediated technology, doesn't mean they're dumb. Lots of wisdom there. But, unfortunately, most electronic means of communication are very poorly matched to how older people have interacted with others all their life. You can believe they are very smart, and also believe they need to interact with electronics/computers/internet resources in a different way than works for the sort of people who comment in HN.

Of course, it varies depending on the person. Most often, the most reliable way of determining if an older person is comfortable with computers is to ask them. Those that find it difficult to make good decisions about passwords/phishing emails/security updates/etc., are more than willing to admit that they aren't great with computers.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#60

Post by johnchristopher »

dontbenebby wrote: post #57
johnchristopher wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, well. A colleague of mine is an historian, in her early 50's I think. For three years now she has been taking notes in her small notepad of the four same shortcuts: ctrl-A, alt-tab, etc. She still doesn't get attachments and doesn't understand the differences between a zip file and a folder (I blame windows but still...). I think she's good at her job (research and producing articles) but she isn't catching up…

I think part of the problem is rote memorization rather than learning concepts. (Eg: maybe if someone learns about the context of a "task switcher" and "shortcut" they could be taught how to search for 'task switcher shortcut windows'. Instead we train users to treat keyboard shortcuts like magical incantations. I don't think that does a service to users of any age.

She's a knowledge worker, highly paid and was in her 20's when computers became ubiquitous.

Her education, the job she's supposed to do... it's like a carpenter who don't want to learn about electric screwdrivers.

As soon as you try to get a bit more general: “Ctrl-A works in any applications or folders or anything with multiple items... it allows you to select everything at once.” She shuts down and gets back to her task of writing stuff.

The thing is: computers aren't magical enough yet for that kind of user.

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