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Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

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Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Upvoting this idea. I've spent quite a few weeks up in cabins producing code that I had a hard time concentrating on elsewhere. Easy access to lots of people with interesting stories (who are generally willing to listen to what you have to say) and opportunities to clear your mind with some intense exercise makes ski resorts a clear winner in my book. Now that I think about it, quite a few of the good developers and…

This sounds like an interesting plan. I'm in the south east U.S, any suggestions on where to apply? What state would be the best? I've got $1k laying around, for a single dude I can make that stretch.

Breckenridge CO is fantastic, as is Vail. Both are expensive.

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#52
I was in exactly your position. Mediocre high school, a few years of a programming job. In my case, I chose a community college followed by a state school followed by a new job.

The choice to go to school is debatable, depends on your money situation. Out of the five years it took me to get my Computer Science bachelor's, I had only about ten really worthwhile classes. The rest just seemed like going through the motions. I think it would have been different if I had picked a different major.

On the other hand, I met my wife and made some of my best friendships at school.

When I think back I consider what I might rather have done instead: build a start-up company, or travel. But both of those would require money that I didn't have, so school (for which I could get loans) was the best choice for me at the time.

If you go:

Community college wasn't the cutting edge of academics, but it was cheap and helped me make the transition. (Read: I had trouble with motivation and getting to class on time, and those mistakes are easier to deal with at a cheap community college.) Get your GPA up and then you'll have your pick of good-quality state schools. High enough and you won't have to pay for them.

I don't regret choosing a state school after that. I'm happy I didn't rack up more student loan debt.

Don't overload yourself with credits. I regret doing so. Take a moderate load and do something interesting with your extra time. (Like your personal programming projects and experiments. Or do research as an undergrad.)

Don't major in computer science. I regret doing so. Major in something "cool," a natural science like Physics or Astronomy, or something you can really sink your brain into like Mathematics or Philosophy, or something that's not easy to pick up as a spare time hobby like electrical engineering. Or any other "real" subject that interests you. Take interesting computer science classes as electives. Minor or double-major in it if you want. You can teach yourself the same amount from a book, and your future employers won't care what your major is in, if you can demonstrate that you know what you're doing. Plus, having some science under your belt can lead to an awesome career of discovery, instead of being a cubicle monkey re-writing back-end software for a greedy bank or telecom company. (Burnout all over again.)

If you're anything like me, and this is my number one regret about school: go to the fucking gym at least three times a week. Doesn't matter if you look great or not: It's free and it's good for your brain. I stopped going to the gym in school citing "lack of time" and slipped into an unmotivated depression that almost ruined my school, my marriage, my basically everything. Do whatever it takes to stay active. I wish I could go back in time with a baseball bat and knock some sense into myself.

After school, if you took out loans to go, you're a slave until you pay them off. If you do the above without failing, you'll get a decent job. I recommend making the minimum payments, live frugally until you build up a savings account. It might be cheaper in the long run to pay the loans off as quickly as possible, but then you don't have the ability to quit a job if you burn out again, and coast or travel the world for a bit.

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#54
post #40

Go to college. Take science to discover something you're good at. Take humanities to discover something you may love. Take at least one art or music class. Take at least one advanced math class. Join a fraternity. Learn how to play bridge (and play all night sometime). Learn how to play foosball. Get drunk. Learn how to play foosball while drunk. Get laid. Play an intramural team sport. Get a part time job. Eat somet…

I've done most of that in one form or another, with nothing but an unfinished high school education. Still am. Every time one of these threads comes along, I get the impression that Americans don't get to have a social/independent life until college. Is it really that way? I'm honestly curious.

(I'm 21 and in Denmark, fwiw.)

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#55
post #40

Go to college. Take science to discover something you're good at. Take humanities to discover something you may love. Take at least one art or music class. Take at least one advanced math class. Join a fraternity. Learn how to play bridge (and play all night sometime). Learn how to play foosball. Get drunk. Learn how to play foosball while drunk. Get laid. Play an intramural team sport. Get a part time job. Eat somet…

I've done most of that in one form or another, with nothing but an unfinished high school education. Still am. Every time one of these threads comes along, I get the impression that Americans don't get to have a social/independent life until college. Is it really that way? I'm honestly curious. (I'm 21 and in Denmark, fwiw.)

I think a lot of it is that here in America, we aren't exposed to many other intelligent thinkers, or many folks interested in much other than their homecoming date, or barely passing the SATs until we get to college. If I'd met just ONE person as inspiring as high school as the tens of them I did in college, I'd have had a significant head start.

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#56
post #40

Go to college. Take science to discover something you're good at. Take humanities to discover something you may love. Take at least one art or music class. Take at least one advanced math class. Join a fraternity. Learn how to play bridge (and play all night sometime). Learn how to play foosball. Get drunk. Learn how to play foosball while drunk. Get laid. Play an intramural team sport. Get a part time job. Eat somet…

And if you are, like I was, repulsed by the constant insistence from everyone that you should go to college so you can toke, drink, party, and fuck: take heart, you can get a lot out of college without ever associating with meatheads and frat houses. The idiot carnival is not as prevalent as popular culture would have you believe; you can invest yourself into a hugely rewarding intellectual field, have excellent roommates that don't make you shove strange objects up your ass, and never even learn the name of your school's sports team, if that's more your style.

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#57

I realized I only enjoy software if I'm building what I want to build or something that interests me. You know what? It's called work because it isn't fun. Most people do a day job to pay the bills. It's part of being a grown-up and it comes with commitments and responsibilities that yeah, sort of suck a lot of the time. Even if you're lucky enough to do something you love for a living (and I am) it isn't passionate…

You know what? It's called work because it isn't fun. Most people do a day job to pay the bills. It's part of being a grown-up and it comes with commitments and responsibilities that yeah, sort of suck a lot of the time. Even if you're lucky enough to do something you love for a living (and I am) it isn't passionate enthusiasm all of the time. Know what? I guess, you're wrong. If you (abstract you , not the you I am…

I think that's idealisitic. I design websites for startups and small businesses, pretty much all of whom are broke. I also spend a lot of time helping them with their online marketing because very few 3rd parties can provide those services inside the kinds of budget my clients are working with.

Do I like doing PPC campaigns? No, I sort of hate it but I do it because the clients I love need it and there isn't anyone else to do it. I wish more of them would get better at doing their own newsletters well, too, but I also want a pony and that isn't happening either, so I do monthly emailings for the clients who need them because I want them to do it right.

Am I passionate about PPC and newsletters? Hell no. But I am passionate about these people and these companies so I do it cheerfully because it's part of my job to do the tedious and annoying stuff that supports all the other work I love to do. I don't think that's pitiful; in fact I am pretty sure that's exactly the way it's supposed to work.

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#59
I turned 20 a couple of months ago and have been working full time for around a year and a half. Now, recently, I started doing contract work and I'm going to travel a bit over the next year. If you do contract work, you can charge a higher rate and thus work less as well -- at least for a while. :)

Also, I'd say go to college if you want to, but don't feel pressured.

Re: Ask HN: 19, developer, burnt out, advice please

#60
post #40

Go to college. Take science to discover something you're good at. Take humanities to discover something you may love. Take at least one art or music class. Take at least one advanced math class. Join a fraternity. Learn how to play bridge (and play all night sometime). Learn how to play foosball. Get drunk. Learn how to play foosball while drunk. Get laid. Play an intramural team sport. Get a part time job. Eat somet…

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