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Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

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Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#51
I'm dismayed to see most of the advice given to you by HN is bad. I am in a very similar situation, and it has been ongoing for years. I have also been bullied for some substantial parts of my life, so I understand the power dynamic very well.

In my recent experience, there is a playbook that you should use. This playbook is designed to be used in a one-on-one setting, between the bully and the person defending herself. I consider it fairly literal; you should memorize this sequence, rehearse it, and play it out as close as possible to how you rehearse. It is also intended to be used without any emotion; the goal is to be as matter-of-fact as humanly possible. It goes like this:

1. Point out a very specific problem behavior (screaming at you, some other event). Be as specific as possible, and use times/dates if you know them. There should be zero ambiguity about this, and the bully should never have leeway to disclaim the event. 2. Explain how it made you feel (angry, demotivated, alienated, etc.) 3. Say "when you did #1, the message I received was (.....) Was that the intended message?". A common example from my own experience is "I feel like I'm perceived as incompetent, and not any value to the team." 4. Regardless of the answer to #3, specifically say the words "In the future, don't do that again." Don't use the words "request" or "would like" in this response. 5. Explain the consequences of breaking directive #4. Something like "If this happens again, I will report the incident to HR (or your manager)."

This recipe has corrected nearly every incident of harassment and bullying I have encountered (well, at least as an adult). It won't fix the underlying issues; someone might still hate your guts, be jealous of you, or use you as a scapegoat. Those are deeper issues that this kind of recipe can't address. Nonetheless, this script directly addresses the problematic behavior, and it opens the door to confronting some deeper problems once the bully realizes that their bullying is visible and unaccepted. Strange as it sounds, most bullies think that their behavior is invisible to all but the victim. Exposing the bully to others can shift the power balance substantially.

The other thing I recommend is to keep a work diary. You don't need to write in it every day (although, in a problem workplace, you may end up with >1 entries a day). In this diary, I encourage you to record events that took place, how you feel about them, and any technical consequences of that event. I have noticed that bullying tends to produce technical changes in team function which hurts the product and hurts the operational efficiency of the group. If these kinds of disputes ever escalate to HR, which sounds very likely in your case, you will need this diary to establish a pattern of behavior and demand resolution. It will become your most valuable tool to improve your situation. It also serves as a somewhat impartial record of what happened. You may decide that, after reviewing X months of work diary, these issues are not that serious, and your emotional reaction is dominating how you feel. In my own case, I expected this to be true (I didn't trust myself enough), but it became obvious after a 1.5-year diary review that the problem wasn't me. :)

Good luck.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#52

Schedule a private 1-on-1, and tell her point blank, "I've noticed that you do to me and it makes me uncomfortable. Why do you do to me?" Either she'll explain why she's a jerk, in which case you can ask her not to do that anymore, or she'll realize she'd been doing something she wasn't aware of and stop. If she feigns ignorance, then you switch from inquisitive to commanding: "Treating me like is negatively impactin…

"I've noticed that you do to me and it makes me uncomfortable. Why do you do to me?"

Uhhmm ... well, I'm not sure this is the best approach, in my opinion.

1)

By framing the discussion as 'why do you do this to me'? It makes the assumption that 'she possibly did something wrong' etc. etc.. It's just a shade accusatory, and I'll bet $100 this person will assume as much.

2)

"Either she'll explain why she's a jerk, in which case you can ask her not to do that anymore, or she'll realize she'd been doing something she wasn't aware of and stop."

There's no chance of the former, and a very small chance of the latter.

If you're going to have a 1-on-1, I think it should probably avoid the specifics of the past (because it will just be something to argue over) - and say something like:

"Hey, Mary Sue, it seems we got off on the wrong foot here, I'm pretty new, I don't know how things work, why don't you help me figure out how we can work together and get things done"

1) By being a somewhat apologetic without admitting any wrongdoing ...

2) By avoiding 'things in the past' to nitpick ...

3) By assuming some humility about 'being new' and therefore maybe not knowing everything ...

4) By not making any reference to her 'doing anything wrong' or 'being wrong' ...

5) By being 'forward looking' and 'trying figure out ways to get stuff done' ...

She'll likely give you a piece of her mind with respect to what she expects in terms of working together. How she handles that might help you decide wether to stay or leave.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#53
post #7

Here's a counter-argument, just in case you need it. Of course I have no idea what the actual situation is. It was hard to find examples of things I'd consider bullying in your post. The only thing seemed to be being screamed at once, which I agree is unacceptable. Everything else seemed explainable as you having had an early disagreement with someone senior to you that led them to initially question your competence,…

It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights. Does it exclude the possibility of me being sexist? No, but it sure as hell keeps it at bay. I do consider the possibility that I made a bad impression. In fact I'm well aware that was a mistake and I tried to fix it by making up for it in any way possible. But…

"It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights."

You do not need to show any 'credentials'. It doesn't matter what things you 'belong to'. You don't need to cower in defence such accusations or 'prove that you're not' something. If in all your self-awareness, you know you're not sexist, well then - you're surely not. The accusations are unfair and baseless.

More extreme: imagine someone accuses you of being a pedophile - you don't react by saying 'how much you love children and would never do such a thing'. Heyzeus! Just act with firm integrity and dismiss the accusation outright and make sure it's known that the accusations are unfair and baseless.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights. Does it exclude the possibility of me being sexist? No, but it sure as hell keeps it at bay. I do consider the possibility that I made a bad impression. In fact I'm well aware that was a mistake and I tried to fix it by making up for it in any way possible. But…

> No, but it sure as hell keeps it at bay. I would avoid this attitude. Assume there are areas where you can improve in this dimension. The fact that you're being defensive on this point here with us is not a good signal. It makes me think that maybe you are being defensive at work as well. The correct response to this is, "I'll keep that in mind and look for ways to improve." There is zero room for making statements…

> "I've gotten the impression that our relationship doesn't have the professional trust I would like it to. I'd like to understand what I can do better."

This! Use these words exactly! How she responds to this will show you what it's all about. Either she gives you concrete examples of what she thinks the problems are and how you two can solve them or she will continue as before. If it's the latter there's probably nothing that will make her change.

> Never complain, never defend.

And this! Even if you 100% in the right, complaining about person A to person B will have a significant chance of you losing face in the eyes of person B (exceptions: you either know person B extremely well (e.g. spouse) or person B has also experienced the faults of person A). Acting defensively will seem as if you're not willing to learn or see your own flaws.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#55
post #7

Here's a counter-argument, just in case you need it. Of course I have no idea what the actual situation is. It was hard to find examples of things I'd consider bullying in your post. The only thing seemed to be being screamed at once, which I agree is unacceptable. Everything else seemed explainable as you having had an early disagreement with someone senior to you that led them to initially question your competence,…

It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights. Does it exclude the possibility of me being sexist? No, but it sure as hell keeps it at bay. I do consider the possibility that I made a bad impression. In fact I'm well aware that was a mistake and I tried to fix it by making up for it in any way possible. But…

> It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights. Does it exclude the possibility of me being sexist? No, but it sure as hell keeps it at bay.

Perhaps this is a nitpicking aside, but let me be clear -- I think there is no correlation at all between attending a feminist rally and not exhibiting general workplace sexism. The idea that attending a rally would make you immune to issues like unconscious biases, sexist condescension, assumptions about technical competence, talking over someone, etc is as ridiculous as the idea that attending an NBA game is a demonstration of proof that you are a competent basketball player. The fact that you even brought it up puts your entire understanding of this situation into doubt for me.

> Edit: From your perspective how can I solve it?

It's tough. You say you're being bullied at work, and if you are, then you have few options -- by definition, bullying involves an unreasonable abuser and an innocent victim. Most of the plausible and good outcomes in this case involve you finding a way to no longer work with this person.

But if you'd instead posted "Ask HN: My coworker screamed at me and told someone else I'd been sexist. What do I do?" then I'd be able to give a very different answer, probably starting with:

(a) I would assume that I had, in fact, done something sexist and upsetting.

(b) I'd ask the person who was upset with me if I could meet privately with them, and I'd tell them that I felt terrible about it; that I badly want to heal the working relationship; that I respect their work and want to put effort into not upsetting them again; that I don't understand what I did but that I understand that this doesn't mean that I didn't do anything, and so on.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights. Does it exclude the possibility of me being sexist? No, but it sure as hell keeps it at bay. I do consider the possibility that I made a bad impression. In fact I'm well aware that was a mistake and I tried to fix it by making up for it in any way possible. But…

"It's not easy to defend yourself against sexist accusations, except that I have proof that I'm an activist and I've rallied for women rights and LGBT rights." You do not need to show any 'credentials'. It doesn't matter what things you 'belong to'. You don't need to cower in defence such accusations or 'prove that you're not' something. If in all your self-awareness, you know you're not sexist, well then - you're su…

> If in all your self-awareness, you know you're not sexist, well then - you're surely not

At least not intentionally. You must still be aware that we all have subconscious biases which can sometimes make you act or say something that can be interpreted as sexist by another party. Maybe a female coworker feels that you are mansplaining things to her but not to your male coworkers?

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#57

As soon as this happens you should report it to HR, insure you reference any materials in the employee/contractor/company code of ethics, etc. There are more then likely laws that would also help resolve this issue too. So insure you report it to HR and call your city/state department of labor and ask away. They are paid to help you out just the same as the IRS or local state government will answer any tax questions…

HR is not your friend. HR is the company's friend. HR will do whatever it thinks is best for the company, not what's best for you.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#58

Schedule a private 1-on-1, and tell her point blank, "I've noticed that you do to me and it makes me uncomfortable. Why do you do to me?" Either she'll explain why she's a jerk, in which case you can ask her not to do that anymore, or she'll realize she'd been doing something she wasn't aware of and stop. If she feigns ignorance, then you switch from inquisitive to commanding: "Treating me like is negatively impactin…

> I've gotten to the point where I record all of my time I spend in the office in order to protect me against claims of sexism because of how detrimental it can be to my career.

I don't know about your employer's policies. But my employer would definitely fire me if they found out I was doing this. I don't think this advice is generally applicable.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#59
Let me tell you something. There are 2 choices in front of you:

1) Loose hope & leave the job - If you choose this option, your PO will come as a winner. After you leave, no one would care if it was your mistake or her but people would most probably forget the incidents and think positive about her. Most of the people will think you had some issues and you left the job. You might find another job but there is no guarantee that you will not find another PO or for that matter any collegue/manager with whom you will NOT have similar issues.

2) Continue in your current Job and commit yourself to improve the situation. Life is presenting with a unique opportunity to you where you can learn how to take control of situation when people disagree with you. IMO, you can learn something very unique out of this situation even if you happen to loose your job after 6 months. This will build a character in you in how to face tough situations. A career is a long journey where you will face situations where people disagree with you. Learning this early in life will help to understand and act better in situations like this. I would say don't worry if you will get a permanent offer from this employer and continue looking for other Job options. If you do find a good job offer then whether to choose that offer should be completely a rational decision based on career growth, salary, technology and not because you are having people issues at your current job. Changing a Job is a life decision and you should be the only one who should take this decision.

Now, there are certain things you should do to improve your current situation at job. By your question, I feel that you had a direct confrontation with your Product Owner. She might not had liked this direct confrontation and is not happy with you. Have a 1:1 discussion with her and understand what you are doing wrong that is making her upset. In the end you will come up as a much more stronger person than her.

Re: Ask HN: I’m being bullied at work. What do I do?

#60
Do Not Apologize! That is a recipe for censure, failure, and a permanent record. It is also a way to guarantee the problem will only get worse. Your apology will be used as an admission of guilt, and she will use this against you.

Ignore the advice which others give here to approach her directly. That too is a recipe for disaster. She will use this "one-on-one" time to drum up additional charges against you. You cannot reconcile with her. There is nothing you can say to change her behavior.

You need to go on the offensive, hard and fast. Document everything. Go over her head. Do not back down. Do not let yourself be intimidated. Stay calm, cool, and collected, and then, when you have everything you need, file charges against her with management.

The goal here is to make her toxic behavior rebound back on her. Do not feel sorry for her. She can end this at any time by changing her behavior. Remember: she is her own worst enemy. You are not the problem. She is creating the environment. She should bear the consequences.

If at all possible, foster an "I don't care what you think about me" attitude when it comes to whatever garbage she invents about you. This is to insulate yourself from your own emotional reaction, which will only damage your case.

Remember: Your goal here is not to reconcile with her. Your goal here is to serve your company and their clients with your best work. She is standing in the way of doing that and is attempting to damage your career in the process.

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