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Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

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491–500 of 733 posts

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#491

> I have come to a realization that I don't really enjoy Software Engineering(& the processes that it comes with) but I do love programming & solving problems. I can almost guarantee that you’re just at the wrong company. Some software companies can turn even the simplest tasks into a grueling series of processes, endless meetings, and joint work across a big number of “stakeholders”. These companies will take the jo…

> Some software companies can turn even the simplest tasks into a grueling series of processes, endless meetings, and joint work across a big number of “stakeholders”. These companies will take the joy and productivity out of programming and replace it with a series of rituals and set of language that people use to go through the motions every week so they can collect paychecks.

god - this is so true at my last company. Any attempts to decrease meetings, remove unnecessary process are met with heavy resistance. Getting shit done was nearly impossible. People had no responsibility for their work. Only wanted "stories" and "subtasks" assigned to them. Doesn't matter if the story was trash/useless/no-op, they just wanted it to pump their numbers because the quarter is ending. I shouldn't have tried so hard to make changes. They probably ended up getting reverted by the next person or manager.

Pro tip: if the company you joined tends to hire new people then retain them. Then fucking run. During the first "all hands" in that company, nearly 80% of people that worked in the organization were hired in the past 1 year or so. It ticked "red flags" at the time but I ignored it because honestly I needed the money at the time (just graduated college)

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#492
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously. It’s hard to imagine a group of 40 people that would need a sufficient velocity of changes/new features to warrant 5 full time engineers.

Imagine each of those people is an employee at the same company, and they each command a salary of say 100k. How much more productive do you need to make them for it to become worth it? If you 3x their productivity, they are now doing the job of 3 people, you just saved 200k _per year_. To tie that back to your comment -- imagine its for a team of 40 users but the company would ideally like them to be a team of 400 u…

>> when I realized how valuable programming is

Definitely. A cheap computer can outperform a billion humans at certain types of tasks. One must merely find the right tasks for the computer in order to exact unfathomable value. AI is going to expand the problem domains that computers can compete in by several orders of magnitude. The era of SPUs (Single Person Unicorn) companies is near.

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#494

> I have come to a realization that I don't really enjoy Software Engineering(& the processes that it comes with) but I do love programming & solving problems. I can almost guarantee that you’re just at the wrong company. Some software companies can turn even the simplest tasks into a grueling series of processes, endless meetings, and joint work across a big number of “stakeholders”. These companies will take the jo…

1000x times this. It's a weird thing our profession. There's a horrible but apt (misogynistic even) saying. Happily married men are happy husbands - Unhappily married men are great philosophers. I really feel agile has killed the happiness of our industry because it's met with a lot of back and forth, meetings, rituals, and meta-work and not actual productivity (If agile is done well though it can be amazing but that…

It's 'gendered', not 'misogynist'.

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#495
post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The original statement will be read by men and some men will connect to it right away, because rather than envision some abstract person, they are made to immediately picture a man, and in that image they may recognize themselves, like looking at a mirror. Sorry, are you saying that the audience of the statement is on purpose only men? If so, how could you possibly support any claim that it's not misogynistic?

Most people here are men. The content will reflect that. Get over it.

Is that not part of why this industry has a problem?

In isolation, it is innocuous, and has the caveat emptor. Though, if you get slapped with, you can't be a great philosopher (for what are happily or unhappily married women other than just spouses), you can't be police, fire fighter, coder, CEO.. it's just another slap in a series if many that occur daily. So, the idea is stop with the isolated examples, and perhaps the bombardment will lessen

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#496
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Language is lovely because you can find so many ways to express creativity! I don't think "Those happily married make great partners, while those unhappily married make great philosophers!" is any less colorful than the original.

Yes, but, there is absolutely nothing wrong with what he said and not reason to correct anything.

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how is implying your happiness is tied to a woman misogynistic?

For sake of mental gymnastics I'll humor you. It's misogynistic because it's rooted in I presume in my culture that women generally don't sit and ponder problems, or resort to alcohol, drugs and crime as bad as men when things go bad. Women generally move on. So that belies a certain belief that women are the cause of all problems - And that is misogynistic.

The statement does not imply those assumptions, and even if it did, it would not be misogyny. The fact there is so much discussion about this is the 'issue' here and it's toxic.

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#498
post #183

> I have come to a realization that I don't really enjoy Software Engineering(& the processes that it comes with) but I do love programming & solving problems. I can almost guarantee that you’re just at the wrong company. Some software companies can turn even the simplest tasks into a grueling series of processes, endless meetings, and joint work across a big number of “stakeholders”. These companies will take the jo…

I think the real "unicorns" are * Small/medium size companies where you recognize most everyone even if you don't work with them. There are enough people so you don't have to do things you're not qualified for like in the very early days of a startup. * Steady growth, but not crazy, venture fueled moonshots. * Selling something that earns enough money to grow the business in a fairly organic way. I worked in a place…

Just curious: why you didn't work there anymore?

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#499
post #491

> I have come to a realization that I don't really enjoy Software Engineering(& the processes that it comes with) but I do love programming & solving problems. I can almost guarantee that you’re just at the wrong company. Some software companies can turn even the simplest tasks into a grueling series of processes, endless meetings, and joint work across a big number of “stakeholders”. These companies will take the jo…

> Some software companies can turn even the simplest tasks into a grueling series of processes, endless meetings, and joint work across a big number of “stakeholders”. These companies will take the joy and productivity out of programming and replace it with a series of rituals and set of language that people use to go through the motions every week so they can collect paychecks. god - this is so true at my last compa…

I'm confused. Aren't all companies that got a round of funding ~1 yr ago going to have a large cohort of <1 yr tenure employees? What connects this to death-by-process?

Re: Ask HN: Do you hate software engineering but love programming?

#500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1000x times this. It's a weird thing our profession. There's a horrible but apt (misogynistic even) saying. Happily married men are happy husbands - Unhappily married men are great philosophers. I really feel agile has killed the happiness of our industry because it's met with a lot of back and forth, meetings, rituals, and meta-work and not actual productivity (If agile is done well though it can be amazing but that…

Why is this saying misogynistic? Because it’s a statement about men or because of the implied possibility they could be unhappy in their marriage? Also, why is it horrible? It appears this world has become manically trigger-happy to label something as -ist or -istic, when it contains even only a hint of something someone could possibly understand the wrong way. It would be curious to examine in a psychological study…

> Why is this saying misogynistic?

It's not; it's the result of a vocal and aggressive mob - people are taking care to not draw the attention of the mob.

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