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Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

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Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#481

Post by rconti »

btrettel wrote: post #389
woah wrote: post #84

I would be careful of overestimating the amount of stimulant use based on comments and emails here. People who use a lot of stimulants tend to love talking about themselves and often have a belief that anyone successful must be taking stimulants secretly. It plays into the motivation of most stimulant users which is that the stimulants have given them a special cheat code in life. I worked in construction in my young…

I'll second this. I don't even drink coffee. I've encountered people who seem absolutely incredulous that I take no stimulants at all. "How do you stay awake?" is something I'm asked. My go-to response now is "I don't. If I'm tired, I get more sleep." Some of these people probably think that I'm lying. There are a lot of people who think that sleeping at work is a bad idea, but I think it's a lot better than guzzling…

Not quite the same, but I used to have a coworker who drank a 2L bottle of Mountain Dew every day. Sure enough, he was the one falling asleep in meetings. I'm sure he felt that the caffeine was necessary to keep him awake, but obviously it wasn't solving the problem -- I imagine the sugar was creating the crash, I know I'm much more sleepy if I eat junk, but then again, I don't know, perhaps he had something else going on.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#482

Post by jacobolus »

Chriky wrote: post #475
btrettel wrote: post #431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people I work with don't know that I don't take stimulants. In fact, it only ever comes up when I decline coffee from someone. I rarely ever mention it, and I hope my post did not come across as sanctimonious. Let me know if and how it did, so I can be more clear in the future. I just wanted to state my preference and reasoning.

It seems utterly nuts to me that someone could sleep at work as a reasonable alternative to drinking coffee. Most jobs and workplaces are just not at all set up to sleep during the working day.

It’s utterly nuts that someone who is tired is still expected to keep “working” without naps. Huge waste of human performance, unless the work is absolutely time-critical (like a legal brief due by the end of the day, or a medical patient who needs urgent care, or some debugging after the whole site just went down).

For most e.g. programming work (deliverable changes due in a week, or a month, or a quarter), it’s more effective to work only a fraction as much time but all of it in a mentally sharp state, rather than to soldier through while exhausted.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#483

Post by rconti »

nathan_long wrote: post #34

Glad you're looking into this. As a counterpoint: I've been a developer 10 years. I've worked at a few established businesses, two startups (one U.S. based and one German), and two consultancies. I worked in-person in Charlotte, N.C. and remotely since then. I've never worked in Silicon Valley. One employer had a "play hard" culture, encouraging alcohol (ab)use outside of work. I didn't stay there long. Perhaps I've…

Working in the valley for the past 10+ years, I've pretty much had the same experience as you. I'm sure in some circles overwork and drug use on the job are the norm, but certainly not everywhere.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#484

Post by obv_throwaway_ »

Eilene wrote: post #301
obv_throwaway_ wrote: post #242

I've made a throwaway account to comment on this, and I've not scanned down through all the comments so you may already have similar stories. I am a software developer based in London, UK who uses several stimulants / drugs in my day-to-day work, I also understand that I am the exception to the rule and whilst I do use a number of substances for many reasons, there are very few of my colleagues that do the same - in…

What is it like for you to work in isolation for so much of the time? Do you think the cannabis and LSD are only for focus or is some of it for (for lack of a better word) escape?

I love it and wouldn't have it any other way. I'm working towards a retirement that will put me in a place as far away from human contact as possible. I get a lot of anxiety from being around people so it's kind of perfect for me.

I don't think those drugs are great for escape. I strictly stick to Sativa strain for cannabis as to not get bogged down with the high and still work. LSD is only when I need to power through the weekends and it's a pretty small dose.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#485

Post by internetman55 »

eric_b wrote: post #376
woah wrote: post #84

I would be careful of overestimating the amount of stimulant use based on comments and emails here. People who use a lot of stimulants tend to love talking about themselves and often have a belief that anyone successful must be taking stimulants secretly. It plays into the motivation of most stimulant users which is that the stimulants have given them a special cheat code in life. I worked in construction in my young…

To add to this - people often equate energy with productivity. I see a lot of comments saying "it was the most productive I've ever been in my life". As someone who's been on both sides, I used to believe stimulants granted exceptional focus and productivity as well. After starting my own business and seeing what real focus and productivity look like, I believe stimulants only help when it comes to slogging through p…

That's why I used to refuse to drink coffee at work. I'll drink coffee sometimes cause I like it, but I'm not gonna take drugs at the expense of my sleep schedule etc. to improve some company's bottom line.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#486

Post by obv_throwaway_ »

pinchharmonic wrote: post #290
obv_throwaway_ wrote: post #242

I've made a throwaway account to comment on this, and I've not scanned down through all the comments so you may already have similar stories. I am a software developer based in London, UK who uses several stimulants / drugs in my day-to-day work, I also understand that I am the exception to the rule and whilst I do use a number of substances for many reasons, there are very few of my colleagues that do the same - in…

Interesting stuff. Around how old are you and around how much do you make? (get as general as you want)

I'm 34 and make £270,000 a year before taxes and bonuses. My bonus is measured against company profits, last year it was £70,000. This year it should be close to £100,000.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#487

Post by jacobolus »

analogic wrote: post #473
ht85 wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I used to smoke, one of my worries about quitting was that I wouldn't be able to do those intense, uninterrupted, full focus 10-12 hours coding sessions. Every couple hours, those 5 delicious minutes, the fresh air, the nicotine rush, then right back at it. I quit smoking a few years ago when my wife got pregnant and have smoked only twice since. I can actually grind more nowadays, and I'm less tired when it end…

ya its kinda crazy. the realization that nicotine doesnt actually calm you, just stops the lack of nicotine from stressing you out.

In low doses (like smoking cessation meds rather than cigarettes) nicotine is a pretty effective occasional stimulant for someone who does not have a tolerance for the drug. https://www.gwern.net/Nicotine

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#488

Post by s73v3r_ »

tmp-20150107 wrote: post #412

so, you can browse my comment history [0] for more detail, but here's the gist: - heroin addict for ~20 years, smoking and iv injecting, plus crack cocaine - senior software engineer at startup, contributing to open source and speaking at conferences and meetups - now trying to quit, using methadone replacement provided by uk national health service my work situation helped by very supportive boss who knows about my…

"(time management for things other than 'obtaining heroin' often suffers as a heroin addict)"

This is horrible, but now I can't help but see your boss creating a Jira ticket for "Acquire heroin".

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#489

Post by tmp-20150107 »

copper_think wrote: post #82
whalesalad wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not so sure about that (never seen it myself)... but cocaine is a LOT more prevalent than people realize. There is a funny meme I saw recently that rings true: Two biggest shocks of adult life. 1. everyone does cocaine 2. cheese is fucking expensive

Man, I really wouldn't. My understanding is that of the people who present to the emergency department with chest pain, something like a third of them have been using cocaine. It causes Real Problems. https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/drug-relate...

This is a little disingenuous, without further elucidation. As far as the statistic you have quoted is concerned, it tells us nothing about how dangerous cocaine is. We need to know how many out of the total population of cocaine users experience chest pain, how many of them go to an ER, and then how many of those (who in total make up 1/3 of ER presentations with chest pain) are further diagnosed with some actual serious problem...

if we don't know what the outcome of these ER visits are, then it could well be that for some tiny percentage of cocaine users there is a side effect that causes the perception of chest pain, which disappears with no ill effects after a few hours. or, maybe, this represents almost all cocaine users - 90% of them experience severe enough chest pain to warrant an ER visit, all of whom are pronounced dead withing minutes of arrival.

annoyingly, the website you linked to which details this singular datum, does nothing to clarify as to what the truth of the matter is. it certainly doesn't appear to be "advancing addiction science" in any useful way...

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#490

Post by s73v3r_ »

opportune wrote: post #351

I can't believe so many people here think none of their colleagues use stimulants. If you don't think they do, and you work somewhere that attracts young competitive people, it's just because nobody told you. I know plenty of people that take them every day and a smaller group of people that take them as-needed (if they need/want to do a marathon-session of coding). I don't know anybody that abuses them, in the sense…

I also think that, for me at least, it's because I tend to avoid those high pressure, perform at all costs companies because, quite frankly, I'm not interested in that kind of environment. I like doing things outside of work.
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