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Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

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Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#431

Post by DoreenMichele »

jandrese wrote: post #374
DoreenMichele wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Walk more. Eat less meat. And pee on a tree. Do that every day. Track it if you need to. Spread the word if you like, though leading by example is more powerful than trying to lecture people. We are all just dust in the wind anyway. But you can choose what your little speck gets up to, at least to some degree.

That's entirely in the "stop digging the hole so fast" category. Except for the tree peeing I think. Actually removing thousands of billions of tons of excess carbon from the atmosphere is still an unsolved problem. We can't do it with trees unless we find a black hole to stuff them into.

I don't actually agree with you, but let's assume you are correct. In my experience, if you don't have an effective solution, but you do know that doing X amounts to "putting out the fire with gasoline," then not doing X is vastly better than continuing to do X while claiming there's no point in trying since we don't have a real solution.

If nothing else, slowing things down and hurtling towards our doom less quickly buys us time to come up with Real Solutions (TM).

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#432

Post by amanaplanacanal »

Here is my take:

Rich people in rich countries will pay what it takes to adapt to the changing climate.

Poor people in poor countries are basically screwed, just like always.

With some luck, the rich people in the rich countries will donate some of their excess wealth to help the poor people adapt too.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#433

Post by JamesBarney »

hliyan wrote: post #285
tobr wrote: post #19

Fundamentally it is a political problem, not a technological problem. We need high carbon taxes, we need to end fossil fuel subsidies, and we probably need to change our economic system to something that addresses the tragedy of the commons. But we’ve seen in recent years how technology can influence politics. I’d quote a tweet from Tristan Harris from the other day [1]: > In an hypothetical world, if Facebook were r…

"Fundamentally it is a political problem" -- Agreed. What if the whole problem is that of "growth"? Here's one possible chain of thought. I don't fully subscribe to this, so please feel free to poke holes in it: 1. The biggest polluters tend to be commercial enterprises 2. They are aware of the environmental impact of their actions, but are reluctant to stop 3. They are staffed by (mostly) normal human beings, but th…

As a stockholders my incentive is to increase my net worth. I do this by investing in companies that produce profits and grow. Now if inflation was to be lowered to 1% or 0% why would I stop being interested in growing companies and getting richer?

And while increasing regulations on climate change would be costly, it's a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of stopping GDP growth and would harms tons of individuals who would find it harder to find a job and provide for their family.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#434

Post by JamesBarney »

dgudkov wrote: post #357
tobr wrote: post #19

Fundamentally it is a political problem, not a technological problem. We need high carbon taxes, we need to end fossil fuel subsidies, and we probably need to change our economic system to something that addresses the tragedy of the commons. But we’ve seen in recent years how technology can influence politics. I’d quote a tweet from Tristan Harris from the other day [1]: > In an hypothetical world, if Facebook were r…

Fundamentally, it's a consumer problem. Consumers don't want to pay more for using green power, or eat less meat, or use public transit instead of a car, buy an electric vehicle, or other things that restrict their comfort or degrade quality of life. Such restriction/degradation would be perceptible and short-term, while the climate threat is not perceptible and is long-term. Nobody really cares if the average temper…

It's a coordination problem. If the diffuse damage of pollution instead was totally concentrated on an individual, people would be very focused on reducing their carbon foot print.

Right now our best technology for dealing with coordination problems are government and treaties.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#435

Post by ben_w »

akvadrako wrote: post #182
ben_w wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wikipedia — which you chose to suggest as a source — Does not at first glance provide citations for other locations. Can you please do so?

Sure, the text of this reference at least agrees with my claim of a general trend: https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/abrupt-climate-change/The%20Younge...

Thanks.

I can’t follow the link from there to (Brauer et al. 2008) as that link is paywalled.

The Greenland graph is essentially vertical, but the Cariaco graph looks like it’s relatively spread out as well as being much smaller magnitude — though even then, the delta is double the current estimated maximum sustainable excess over pre-industrial temperatures.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#436

Post by zamalek »

bluGill wrote: post #356
codingdave wrote: post #239

Don't forget that the small things add up -- small things on their own won't change the world, but they change the lifestyle of one family at a time, and it helps both a little in the short run, and more as children raised in climate-aware homes grow up. If everyone starts making small changes, it will change demand, which changes markets, which changes politics. Some small examples: Walk to the grocery store every o…

Walking to the grocery store means you live within walking distance. That means zoning codes that allow a grocery store in your neighborhood. Most do not allow that.

Electric bicycles and boards have absurdly low energy consumption.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#437

Post by bskinny129 »

Great timing! I also believe it takes personal actions, not waiting on someone else.

My personal pledge is to balance the negative impact of my driving and flying. If you are interested, check out the app I'm building for it: https://www.producthunt.com/upcoming/pledge-balance

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#438

Post by TeMPOraL »

jjeaff wrote: post #409
TeMPOraL wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Human societies can have individuals doing all that. Stable, large societies. The astronauts can survive in the vacuum of space because of technology, and they can get to space because of technology - technology that is backed by hundreds of thousands of people all across the greater economic machine that built the rocket and the space suits, and supplied and fed everyone involved. As individuals, we're not much more…

Without our technology, we can still run farther and longer than any other species, use our delicate fingers and opposable thumbs, control fire, and make and use tools and solve relatively complex puzzles. As a species, without our tech, we are head and shoulders above most species.

Sort of. But fire and tools are technology, the very lowest tier. Our ability to stack technology, to use tools to build better tools, is what makes us interesting - as long as we actually make use of this ability.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#440

Post by explainplease »

perfunctory wrote: post #225
otabdeveloper2 wrote: post #60

> We have 12 years to prevent a climate catastrophe I don't know how old you are, but those of us over 20 remember that we had '12 years' 20 years ago. Somehow the prophesied catastrophe never arrives and the date gets perpetually pushed into the future. Looks like a secular Seventh Day Adventists.

> Somehow the prophesied catastrophe never arrives and the date gets perpetually pushed into the future. If anything, the date gets pushed back. With every subsequent IPCC report it turns out the previous as an underestimation.

> If anything, the date gets pushed back.

That's what "pushed into the future" means. "Back" means "further away," "up" means "closer."

> With every subsequent IPCC report it turns out the previous as an underestimation.

So, every IPCC report has been wrong. How long are you going to keep believing them? Sounds like a religion.

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