Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

news.ycombinator.com

411–419 of 419 posts

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This whole problem seems like it would go away with more sophisticated interview questions. Interviews should be precisely about stuff that you can't just google. Googling information is pretty much a required basic competency nowadays, right next to reading and writing.

Being able to look up stuff is important but there is also a baseline of knowledge that is really important. If I'm working with somebody in a meeting and they need to stop every 30 seconds to look up a term or concept then we aren't going to be able to collaborate effectively.

Tell me with a straight face that this ever happened to you.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

interview fail: googled answers to questions daily job: google answers to questions.

Although I think I get the intended humour, the daily job certainly shouldn't be to Google answer to questions. Google to get to documentation... Sure. Reading documentation.. Sure. Ability to understanding it and how it is used, that's what would be missing, and what is suggested the interview question failed to pick up on.

That's an illusion. Almost all of a coder's daily work is stuff that has been done already about a hundred thousand times. Every time I'm coding on easy mode (eg some sort of personal project where I have all the leeway) I can get through all of it just by googling $language how to $x ... been doing exactly this workflow recreationally during times when I don't feel like exerting myself for years now. It's neither slower nor does it provide worse results than in situations where I'm dealing with technologies I know inside out. With the tougher stuff, you should be consulting your colleagues anyways. If no one knows - then you research together... on google.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If he fails to deliver on the job, put them on a PIP and get rid of them. If he actually delivers good work, who cares if he cheats?

Is he actually doing the work? Is just copying code from OSS projects and does not actually understand it? Not only will this cause legal liability, but when the team is under stress will he just disappear or be able to solve an issue? He already lied once. Why not lie more?

Lying is already rampant on both sides of the hiring process, and expected. The high stakes and algorithmic nature of (tech) hiring is the real problem - the rewards are great and the exploits are obvious.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting! Maybe the stereotype of a tech interview is not the common experience of most developers? This would make more sense and leads me to think that HR is just justifying it's own existence with baroque processes that then make it even less relevant and useful.

FYI I went through a large phase in 2020-2021 where I responded to around 75 job offers and overall had 1-5 calls with ~35 companies each. My cover letter contains a standard phrase about "references available on request". No one requested them.

Every so often I come across a useful and hard to find data point - this is one of those times. Thanks for sharing this.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#415
post #7

This is exactly why the technical interview process is what it is. No point wasting time asking about backgrounds and describing past projects (all of it can be easily faked). Make them write code in front of you live as part of the screening round.

> Make them write code in front of you live as part of the screening round. I think there's always lots of arguing over what's the correct way to do this. Ideally, I think you'd basically have any number of options, from which you (the candidate) could pick whatever feels the most suitable: [ ] - solve an algorithmic problem in person, show code, discuss now [ ] - solve an algorithmic problem later, share Git repo, d…

> Of course, one could argue that some would exploit this to just rotate people after 3 months for low salaries, but I would at least hope that such attempts would be glaringly obvious and not much would get done in just 3 months of work.

As a candidate you should be able to detect easily during the interview that it would a bad place to work for.

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#416
I know this is going to be controversial comment and I'm sad to say it... But quite frankly, I can safely say that just about every Indian developer that applied to my jobs and made it passed the initial filters STILL turned out to be a scammer of sorts. Either fake skills background listed; they must be getting away with it at least to some degree if I'm coming across it at this scale!!

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#417
post #59

This sounds like what I wanted to do once I realized how insanely easy remote work was. I do my wife's code for her dev job and it honestly works out to like 2 hours a week for me. She spends maybe 10 hours in meetings, so it totally makes sense to put 3 or 4 front people in positions to handle the meetings and just funnel the work back to me. Sounds like they are doing a bait and switch strategy though. You should j…

> I do my wife's code for her dev job and it honestly works out to like 2 hours a week for me. >She spends maybe 10 hours in meetings

Watch out, if she attends all those productivity sapping meetings, and turns in good code then she'll quickly be promoted to a position that requires no coding. Then that'll be the end of the fun coding :)

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#418
post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's fraudulent about it, assuming it's not violating any employment agreements?

In that case it wouldn’t be, but from what I’ve seen online most of the forums, tips etc about this are for people with two full-time jobs they “work” simultaneously and not for people who legitimately go to their second job after finishing their first job. Good luck finding an employer who agrees to that.

> Good luck finding an employer who agrees to that.

Just look for the phrase "results only work environment."

Re: Ask HN: Anyone having issues with job applicant fraud?

#419
post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At tech companies, "contractor" usually means someone contracted from a staffing company to work 40 hour weeks during normal business hours. They're not someone who is providing an end product with the freedom to set their own schedule, like you typically think of when you hear "contractor".

That very much depends on location. In the UK a contractor could be someone from an outsourcing company as you suggest or they could be an independent service provider working on their own. This is very common in software dev here when you require someone with specific skills. If you’re the latter kind then you’d be wise to bill on deliverables rather than time. If you don’t you could run into a well known tax reg ca…

> bars independent contractors from acting like “disguised” employees. It’s a world of pain if that happens.

The US allows companies to fire long-term employees without cause and replace them with indentured servants.

We're the ones who actually hosted the cotton fields full of slaves, after all.

Post reply on HN