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Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

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Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#411

Post by kelnos »

cryoshon wrote: post #100
Blahah wrote: post #42

I am open to discussing this in raw detail - contact in my profile. Most programmers, scientists, people in finance and startups I know take a lot of stimulants. I take a lot of stimulants. [Edit - as others have pointed out, there's a strong selection bias going on here. I actively seek out people who I know take stimulants, and we naturally congregate socially based on a bunch of subtle and explicit cues that signa…

chiming in here to corroborate that stimulant use/abuse is heavily prevalent in scientists and startup types that i know. even the md/phd types who have been in clinical practice for 20 years do it, even after they've had kids etc. most only abuse coffee-- you can tell because the norm is to drink coffee until you're literally red in the face when there is serious work to get done. there are people who abstain, of co…

> there are a few who smoke weed / take xanax at work to calm down, but these are frowned upon somewhat.

I find that attitude hilarious. Rampant stimulant abuse is the norm and is accepted, but combining with another drug to calm down is a no-no? Amazing.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#412

Post by tmp-20150107 »

so, you can browse my comment history [0] for more detail, but here's the gist:

- heroin addict for ~20 years, smoking and iv injecting, plus crack cocaine

- senior software engineer at startup, contributing to open source and speaking at conferences and meetups

- now trying to quit, using methadone replacement provided by uk national health service

my work situation helped by very supportive boss who knows about my problem, and encouraged me to take steps to fix it when he saw my work was suffering (time management for things other than 'obtaining heroin' often suffers as a heroin addict) but not told anyone else.

there was a bad situation at a previous job where i had good health insurance that enabled me to enter a private rapid detox program (then naltrexone implants to stop opiates having any effect for the next six months, plus CBT/counselling) but then my immediate manager got me fired essentially for completely arbitrary and made up reasons, but i was unable to do anything about that due to not wanting anyone else to know i was an addict.

various interesting things happened to me while travelling to conferences or remote customer offices, often in other countries. it's actually fairly easy to buy heroin on the street anywhere in the world, it turns out, even without speaking the language.

if you'd like more information, feel free to ask me anything and i'll try and reply if i can.

0. https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=tmp-20150107

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#413

Post by Eilene »

kelnos wrote: post #380
nathan_long wrote: post #34

Glad you're looking into this. As a counterpoint: I've been a developer 10 years. I've worked at a few established businesses, two startups (one U.S. based and one German), and two consultancies. I worked in-person in Charlotte, N.C. and remotely since then. I've never worked in Silicon Valley. One employer had a "play hard" culture, encouraging alcohol (ab)use outside of work. I didn't stay there long. Perhaps I've…

I definitely fall on this side of the scale. I've certainly heard of people using "performance enhancers" in a programming context, and have seen hard drug use at parties (very infrequently), but it was never my thing (hell, I don't even drink coffee), and none of the people I know well and consider solid developers have a drug habit. I think -- and this cuts both ways -- people into the drug scene naturally gravitat…

I would love to see a study too.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#414

Post by smoyer »

btrettel wrote: post #389
woah wrote: post #84

I would be careful of overestimating the amount of stimulant use based on comments and emails here. People who use a lot of stimulants tend to love talking about themselves and often have a belief that anyone successful must be taking stimulants secretly. It plays into the motivation of most stimulant users which is that the stimulants have given them a special cheat code in life. I worked in construction in my young…

I'll second this. I don't even drink coffee. I've encountered people who seem absolutely incredulous that I take no stimulants at all. "How do you stay awake?" is something I'm asked. My go-to response now is "I don't. If I'm tired, I get more sleep." Some of these people probably think that I'm lying. There are a lot of people who think that sleeping at work is a bad idea, but I think it's a lot better than guzzling…

I do drink coffee but have no problem sleeping when I'm tired and, over 35 years of engineering have learned to tell when I'm "sharp". There are plenty of tasks you can take on when you're a little tired too. I don't sleep as long as many people because I have a bad back bit I'd trade that tiny "competitive advantage in a heartbeat.

Other than caffeine I don't take drugs and mostly don't drink alcohol either.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#415

Post by Eilene »

CryoLogic wrote: post #174

I worked in a very toxic post-series-A tech startup trying to get acquired. We where all expected to work 8am-10pm and the CEO would always tell us that if we wanted to move up in the company we needed to work weekends as well. Just a 15 minute break would get you a lecture on work ethic from one of the upper-management who really micromanaged engineers. After about a year there I learned about half my team was takin…

How long ago was this? (also, how awful)

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#417

Post by kelnos »

iooi wrote: post #211
CryoLogic wrote: post #174

I worked in a very toxic post-series-A tech startup trying to get acquired. We where all expected to work 8am-10pm and the CEO would always tell us that if we wanted to move up in the company we needed to work weekends as well. Just a 15 minute break would get you a lecture on work ethic from one of the upper-management who really micromanaged engineers. After about a year there I learned about half my team was takin…

I wish there was a culture of naming and shaming these companies and executives. This is the sort of behavior that would be really easy for engineers to abolish by simply not working there.

Unfortunately, doing so can be a risk. If the target of such comments gets wind of it, they could easily sue for defamation or libel, and possibly even win, given that it's probably hard to back up a lot of these accusations in a way that would hold up in court.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#418

Post by mncolinlee »

I haven't really noticed much of anything in recent years. That should be surprising, since many of our sites are in states that have legal weed. However, there's a decent amount of coffee use and many of us drink a microbrew beer late in the afternoon once or twice a week. I believe the Ballmer Effect is real, but it's also risky and no one wants to be perceived as having a drinking problem.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#419

Post by Andrex »

btrettel wrote: post #389
woah wrote: post #84

I would be careful of overestimating the amount of stimulant use based on comments and emails here. People who use a lot of stimulants tend to love talking about themselves and often have a belief that anyone successful must be taking stimulants secretly. It plays into the motivation of most stimulant users which is that the stimulants have given them a special cheat code in life. I worked in construction in my young…

I'll second this. I don't even drink coffee. I've encountered people who seem absolutely incredulous that I take no stimulants at all. "How do you stay awake?" is something I'm asked. My go-to response now is "I don't. If I'm tired, I get more sleep." Some of these people probably think that I'm lying. There are a lot of people who think that sleeping at work is a bad idea, but I think it's a lot better than guzzling…

As a corollary to the OP, it seems like the people who deliberately don't take stimulants _also_ love talking about themselves and how it's a superior lifestyle. :)

Not saying you're wrong, but the sanctimony from both sides can be a little exhausting is all.

Re: Ask HN: I'm writing a book about white-collar drug use, including tech sector

#420

Post by jacquesm »

emptysongglass wrote: post #377
jacquesm wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The guy is in a power relationship with his subordinates, he is definitely not the one to go and prescribe medication. The best thing he could have done is to send you to a doctor. If a CEO here in NL suggested I take some pills in order to improve my productivity and offered to supply them my first step would be to inform the board in writing and my second would be to resign my position. This is simply not ok, and n…

These moral fiat statements are unhelpful to no one. You simply don’t know the context. In a very flat power structure or a very small company (2 to 3 employees) at the office, social dynamics change dramatically. Never mind that caffeine is legal yet it’s the shittiest productivity drug I can imagine yet everyone is falling over themselves to serve it to you and get you one while they’re out on break. I’d much prefe…

> These moral fiat statements are unhelpful to no one.

Nice to see we agree.

> social dynamics change dramatically.

I'm sorry, but whatever the 'social dynamics' as a person in a position of authority over another there are some lines you should never cross. Not knowing what your mandate is as a CEO is a recipe for disaster.

If an employee has a productivity issue a CEO does not have mandate to prescribe - or even suggest - medication. The fact that that needs spelling out is worrisome.

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