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Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

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Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#401

Post by dboreham »

pc86 wrote: post #296
dboreham wrote: post #295

Expense. We looked into it when the kids were little but concluded we would need to hire at least one full time teacher (wife and I both work) and therefore would need to aggregate with several other families. At that point you're starting a school and we observed that we were already paying (handsomely) for the public school. That said we did supplement our kids education at the elementary level with a once-a-week s…

Doesn't homeschooling by definition sort of presuppose one of the parents staying home and teaching? That's the only context in which I've ever heard it discussed.

It amounts to the same thing doesn't it? Either you perform the work yourself, or you work a job for which you're paid and then pay someone to perform the work. I think the essence of home schooling is schooling in the home, or outside of official education institutions.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#402

Post by xpe »

verisimilidude wrote: post #392
tomtheelder wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Swim lessons? Get out of here. Church? I did imagine that. Try reading. I think we agree on this subject, but as a 3rd party in this back and forth I have to say that this is not appropriate discourse for this site. Please try to interpret others comments as charitably as possible. There is never a justification for saying something snarky and rude like "Get out of here" or "Try reading".

He’s the one who told me I was “unimaginative” and to “give my head a shake”. I just responded in kind. Don’t blame me for being a better asshole when he initiated that tone. My contribution to civility here was to just stop responding.

> He’s the one who told me I was “unimaginative” and to “give my head a shake”. I just responded in kind. Don’t blame me for being a better a*hole when he initiated that tone.

Yes, you are not the only one using unkind words.

Still, most of the time, each of us (and therefore all of us as an online community) can do better. You have various options. It is tempting to fall into the attack/counter-attack posture. But instead of counter attacking, you can say something like "That was unkind" and leave it there.

> My contribution to civility here was to just stop responding.

A fair point. Doing so is preferable to adding fuel to the fire. Even better IMO is to reassert the community norms firmly without insulting the other person.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#403

Post by xpe »

Turing_Machine wrote: post #197
verisimilidude wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell us where homeschooled kids get their socialization. Church? That's a bit like the pot calling the kettle black when it comes to social distortion. Homeschooled peer groups? There's no way that's a broader population than the school in 99.9% of homeschooling scenarios.

> Tell us where homeschooled kids get their socialization. Out in the real world, as opposed to an artificial environment designed to produce obedient factory workers.

> an artificial environment designed to produce obedient factory workers.

Well, no, not exclusively designed for that -- or any one thing. There are many stakeholders and it is fairly difficult to use the word design. I'd suggest evolved might serve as a better metaphor.

(People cite historic factors connecting school to factory workers. I tend to agree, but probably only because people have told me this; I haven't read primary sources on this. Anyhow, I'll grant it for sake of argument.)

Schools in the USA, as I understand them, attempt (with widely divergent success) to prepare students for a mixture of futures: perhaps college, perhaps trade schools, and perhaps general background for citizenship.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#404

Post by snapplebobapple »

Not believing in God has really limited my kids access to the social club that is religion, which makes me uncomfortable removing the other major access to kids their own age, school. Atheists/agnostics just aren't as organized in supporting their offspring's social development, probably because they have less kids.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#405

Post by troupe »

somethoughts wrote: post #269
troupe wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are willing to do stuff online, the cost for a math tutor is only a fraction of what you described.

The real shame is that the material is all essentially free. The challenge as with all MOOCs and online (and offline) educational material is that its not fun and its hard to stay motivated. And this is true doubly so for kids. It'd be interesting to what extent the fees that normally would be spend on tutoring expenses could be spent on prizes or some other reward - without cheapening the experience (i.e. taking awa…

There have been some experiments of just giving kids cash for getting good grades in public schools.

Motivating your children to do things that are good for them in the long run (brushing their teeth, not hitting other people, etc.) is very much in the wheel house of parenting.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#406

Post by xpe »

anon291 wrote: post #397
xpe wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah, he brought up religion for no particular reason. Saying that someone brought something up "for no particular reason" is not respectful. Just because you don't understand the reason is not a valid justification for being dismissive.

We were talking about liberals and conservatives. Conservatives are not universally religious and liberals are not universally irreligious. What is more disrespectful is attempting to change the subject to take the discussion in a direction that, if it were headed there to begin with, I would not have engaged.

> What is more disrespectful is attempting to change the subject to take the discussion in a direction that, if it were headed there to begin with, I would not have engaged.

I'm flabbergasted by your words. I don't know your life circumstances, your age, where you live, what you've been through, etc. I do wonder if you are having a particularly bad day or week or month.

I don't mean this as an insult: if you need support, please seek it out.

Perhaps (like many) you lack some important communication skills or emotional awareness. These can be learned.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#407

Post by xpe »

anon291 wrote: post #397
xpe wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah, he brought up religion for no particular reason. Saying that someone brought something up "for no particular reason" is not respectful. Just because you don't understand the reason is not a valid justification for being dismissive.

We were talking about liberals and conservatives. Conservatives are not universally religious and liberals are not universally irreligious. What is more disrespectful is attempting to change the subject to take the discussion in a direction that, if it were headed there to begin with, I would not have engaged.

In my other comment, I expressed concern about your well-being. Here I'm discussing the substance of your comment ...

> We were talking about liberals and conservatives. Conservatives are not universally religious and liberals are not universally irreligious. What is more disrespectful is attempting to change the subject to take the discussion in a direction that, if it were headed there to begin with, I would not have engaged.

1. I've said this before -- not sure if I did on this thread -- so I'll say it again: you seem to think that you get to define what is on topic and isn't. No, you don't. People are free to discuss as they see fit.

2. Logic isn't the whole story. Your words are coming across as self-important. That will not serve you well. It repels people, including me. I'm only writing in the hopes that this will get through to you or someone else that reads it. There are too many people here lacking fundamental discussion skills.

3. Invite feedback and learn. Ask 10 wise people to read your sentence. Do not pre-bias them. Ask for their unvarnished feedback. Discuss and actively listen without defending yourself.

4. What you wrote looks like a justification to make you feel better about yourself. Almost everyone does it. Some people become aware of it. Some people learn to do better.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#409

Post by xpe »

wyager wrote: post #375
xpe wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> State-based education is funded largely because it is in the interest of the state to educate citizens to participate in government and exist in a pluralistic society > This is not an even approximately correct model for why the state bankrolls public education in the US. I'd be interested to hear about your model. Please tell me what kind of model you mean. Are you familiar with the phrase: "All models are wrong,…

The first-order reason the current regime funds education is that it is a pork-barrel jobs program (especially for college-educated women). The second-order reason is that the regime is mostly staffed by religious adherents to state-secularism, and the public education system is their pulpit. And no, I'm not irritated - I don't think there's an efficient way to have a worthwhile discussion about someone's religious b…

> And no, I'm not irritated - I don't think there's an efficient way to have a worthwhile discussion about someone's religious beliefs over the internet without coming across as slightly hostile. Apologies.

Thanks.

Yes, it is hard without knowing much about the cultures and communication style of the other people. But I think there are some simple things that help: write, then wait a few minutes before posting. Re-read and edit if you think the tone can be fixed. Etc.

Re: Ask HN: If you’ve considered homeschooling, what’s stopping you?

#410

Post by xpe »

wyager wrote: post #378
xpe wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why are you talking about >> classical liberalism, the scientific method, liberal arts, music, pedagogy, statistics > when our conversation was about >> Liberalism and pluralism > (your words)? I'm going to make a few points in different threads to ease replies. First, let's step back. We are different people having a conversation. I often see people claiming the other person is off topic. Such a claim assumes that…

I have a habit of ignoring "tone" in discussions on relatively intelligent message boards because I think most of the people I'm talking to can handle it, and it makes the discussion vastly more likely to transmit valuable information. I'm not trying to police the topic of your commentary; I'm just not letting you swap out "liberalism and pluralism" with "classical liberalism, the scientific method, liberal arts, mus…

> I have a habit of ignoring "tone" in discussions on relatively intelligent message boards because I think most of the people I'm talking to can handle it, and it makes the discussion vastly more likely to transmit valuable information.

Thanks for sharing that. I can relate, but I do it in a more targeted fashion. As I get to know someone better, I adjust my communication style. This is an ongoing process. For example, I can increase my "bluntness factor" or rely on shared understandings to skip over lengthy explanations.

Paying attention to tone and emotions in communication is tremendously important. Relatively intelligent people still have emotions, and they still underly what is being said, particularly around topics close to home like religion and philosophy.

Also, paying attention to tone doesn't have to degrade the quality of information conveyed. It might require a few more words -- or a bit more clarity, such as being careful who you are addressing. (See your other comments, where your intended recipient wasn't clear.) It does require more energy and skill to pay attention to emotion and content. I happen to think it is worth it.

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