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Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

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Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#41

Post by paulcole »

kar5pt wrote: post #38
paulcole wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think the pandemic in general has proven that people don't need to be in-person to be effective and innovative.) Yes, for some subset of people. Many people found they did prefer to be in-person to be effective, innovative, and enjoy their work. Some companies are going to want to hire those people and avoid hiring the ones who don’t prefer in-person work. Nothing wrong with that. It’s somebody at the the company…

So why not let people decide for themselves whether they want to be remote? You're assuming in person workers are more effective, which is precisely what's in question to begin with.

How is my assumption different from the pro-remote work people who assume remote workers are more effective.

Both sides here think they’re correct and are incredibly dogmatic and protective of their side.

Companies can choose to let workers decide. It’s definitely one of the options available. But companies can also mandate RTO or mandate continued remote work.

All of those choices allow the employee to decide if the company’s choice is a dealbreaker for them when it comes to where they choose to work.

Another issue is that the pro-remote workers love to assume that a pro-office person sitting alone in the office while everyone else works remotely makes everyone happy. This isn’t always the case.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#42

Post by MaxHoppersGhost »

JohnFen wrote: post #20
MaxHoppersGhost wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a cynical take. Why is it so ridiculous to believe that teams that work together in-person are more effective/innovative?

Because there's no evidence that this is the case, and there's a lot of lived experience saying that it isn't.

>lived experience

So anecdotes?

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#43

Post by DANmode »

MaxHoppersGhost wrote: post #18
yuppie_scum wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s just internet points

I don’t care about points but it’s annoying when dissenting opinion gets buried. Back in the day the only HN comments that got downvoted were flamebait or trolling.

Essential: using a client that showDead by default.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#44

Post by thiht »

MaxHoppersGhost wrote: post #12
codegeek wrote: post #5

Let me give you a different perspective than "employers want power" etc. Not everyone can work remotely. Remote 100% is not always the answer. If you are entry level and want to learn from your peers and seniors, nothing beats in person collaboration. Nothing. People can claim otherwise and it may be true for a small percentage of people but if you have less than 3 years of real professional experience, 100% remote i…

[flagged]

Who cares? Don’t give too much value to downvotes.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#45

Post by ineedausername »

codegeek wrote: post #5

Let me give you a different perspective than "employers want power" etc. Not everyone can work remotely. Remote 100% is not always the answer. If you are entry level and want to learn from your peers and seniors, nothing beats in person collaboration. Nothing. People can claim otherwise and it may be true for a small percentage of people but if you have less than 3 years of real professional experience, 100% remote i…

+1. Remote is not healthy for everyone either, and we should stop pretending otherwise.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#46

Post by flappyeagle »

lmarcos wrote: post #15
codegeek wrote: post #5

Let me give you a different perspective than "employers want power" etc. Not everyone can work remotely. Remote 100% is not always the answer. If you are entry level and want to learn from your peers and seniors, nothing beats in person collaboration. Nothing. People can claim otherwise and it may be true for a small percentage of people but if you have less than 3 years of real professional experience, 100% remote i…

> People can claim otherwise and it may be true for a small percentage of people but if you have less than 3 years of real professional experience, 100% remote is a bad idea. So, if I have 15 years of experience can I work from home? Hum. All the juniors in the office, all the seniors at home. That's it? Or just because some engineers do not know how to work remotely, then I too should be dragged to the office? Nonse…

> So, if I have 15 years of experience can I work from home? Hum. All the juniors in the office, all the seniors at home.

I don't know how open you are to an actual answer, but here goes: The short answer is yes, but here are nuances.

Things I've seen work

1. Fully remote companies with a high density of experienced talent and very few (sometimes none) juniors. Everyone is expected to be professional, responsible, know when they need help or get stuck, deliver production ready stuff in the first or second iteration. Juniors get at least 2 1:1s per week from their manager and a senior IC colleague. 2-4x a year, company has a conference/convention where everyone gathers in a single location.

2. Hybrid approach, with some fully remote hires, exclusively at senior level, with a focus on the high end. All juniors in office, with a mix of junior-senior employees. People can and do work remotely 2-3x a week. Regular events when everyone comes into the office.

Things that absolutely do not work

1. Fully remote team with a lot of junior people. They get isolated, don't get the mentorship they need, end up working inefficiently for too long getting stuck on basic things because they don't know when to ask questions, and they don't have enough dedicated mentorship to be supported.

2. Hybrid team with fully remote junior members. This is the worst case scenario. Those team members are doubly isolated, both by their physical distance and by the issues detailed in (1)

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#47

Post by flappyeagle »

ipaddr wrote: post #28
mikhael28 wrote: post #25

Remote works for some people, for most it probably doesn't work. There is a reason why everyone doesn't have six pack abs - the same reason why people are, in general, more 'productive' when they have people in their immediate vicinity to hold them accountable. Instead of having the possibility of playing videogames at home, while being online on Slack. It's kinda common sense - humans have a limited amount of willpo…

If I can't trust you to work on your own whether it is in the office or at home you are not someone I want to hire. Babysitting employees is a waste of resources.

I can't trust ME to stay on task when there are so many distractions at home.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#48

Post by flappyeagle »

mikhael28 wrote: post #26
mikhael28 wrote: post #25

Remote works for some people, for most it probably doesn't work. There is a reason why everyone doesn't have six pack abs - the same reason why people are, in general, more 'productive' when they have people in their immediate vicinity to hold them accountable. Instead of having the possibility of playing videogames at home, while being online on Slack. It's kinda common sense - humans have a limited amount of willpo…

Also, the reasons mentioned in this thread of execs trying to re-establish previous power hierarchies pre-COVID.

Why do you think execs have less power remotely?

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#49

Post by flappyeagle »

lmarcos wrote: post #16
jstx1 wrote: post #8

> The best I have is that this is some kind of power play but I'm not convinced. Am I missing something? You can consider that not everyone has the same preferences as you. Many people are more productive and happier working from an office and meeting their colleauges in person. Forcing people into limited open space with unassigned seats sounds like terrible execution of return to office but in general RTO doesn't h…

> You can consider that not everyone has the same preferences as you. Many people are more productive and happier working from an office and meeting their colleauges in person. You mean, that to each their own right? I agree, but RTO is the opposite. RTO forces everyone to work from the office. If you prefer to work from the office, go ahead be my guest. I prefer to work from home. It's a win-win, right? No. Just bec…

what if I don't prefer to work with people that prefer to be at home? what if you don't prefer to work with people like me? I guess we are a bad fit then and should part ways.
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