https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_pe... It’s really interesting to sort that country list by median, then by mean, each time looking for the USA.
That's wealth though. OP is asking about income.
Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
41–50 of 175 posts
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#42Mainly because USA developed multiple geographic clusters where software developers are in high demand (Bay Area for consumer tech, New York for finance etc.) and the funding ecosystem is both deep-pocketed and culturally supports paying for talent. Traditionally European VCs and founders both operated under the assumption that startups need to save money rather than spend to get the best. And consequently those star…
Most coders don't work in tech or startups, but in regular businesses. An yet, they still make more in the US than in Europe. Perhaps it falls in line with general lower compensation in Europe - I mean, for example there are plenty job offers for accountants in London (super-expensive city) which advertise sub 30k pounds pay per year. I don't think there are a lot of accountants in NYC who would take a job for the equivalent $35k...
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#43https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_pe... It’s really interesting to sort that country list by median, then by mean, each time looking for the USA.
That's wealth though. OP is asking about income.
Yes, so isn’t it interesting that all that high income isn’t translating into high median wealth?
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
Find a job with a US company that has a UK presence (a multinational like Google, Facebook etc.) and get promoted enough (e.g: to Engineering Manager) to be eligible for an L1 visa, then request to transfer from the UK to the US. The L1 visa process is the easiest, and has a path to citizenship. https://www.nnuimmigration.com/l1-visa-to-green-card/ (UK salaries are competitive enough nowadays that it's not really wor…
Compensation is competitive now? Last I looked (couple years), anywhere outside London was really low.
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Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#45What are the best ways to get hired in the US as a software engineer from the UK? I’ll be graduating with a masters in CS from a top university in 2023.
Find a job with a US company that has a UK presence (a multinational like Google, Facebook etc.) and get promoted enough (e.g: to Engineering Manager) to be eligible for an L1 visa, then request to transfer from the UK to the US. The L1 visa process is the easiest, and has a path to citizenship. https://www.nnuimmigration.com/l1-visa-to-green-card/ (UK salaries are competitive enough nowadays that it's not really wor…
How are UK salaries competitive? Even in London, salaries are, at best, 50% of what they are in Silicon Valley for 'typical' companies. At FAANG companies (e.g.: the Google/FB/etc London offices), they are about 70% of what they are in Silicon Valley. Cost of living is higher in SV, but not that much higher.
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#46Compared to Europe there is more upside and downside risk in the US. You can earn more but you are more likely to be financially wiped out if you get cancer or have an accident (high medical costs). Most countries in Europe have more social support built in at every level, not just healthcare, so its unusual to go from living comfortably to being on the street. Some argue the US way is good (more downward mobility is…
I live in London. Developed a persistent headache which goes on for a few months already. Just got appointment to a neurologist for August 2023. Today is September 2022. Although, is UK in Europe?...
Yep, that's how the coveted socialized health care system looks like in practice in many European countries. Sometimes the queue is short and you can use it. Sometimes it's not and you go to a private doctor instead. Sometimes, the nececessary drug is refunded and you get it for nearly free. Other times it's not and you buy it out of pocket. If it happens to be expensive, it will bankrupt your family just the same (or, more often, just die instead, because you don't want to do that to your family for an off chance of surviving the illness).
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#47Compared to Europe there is more upside and downside risk in the US. You can earn more but you are more likely to be financially wiped out if you get cancer or have an accident (high medical costs). Most countries in Europe have more social support built in at every level, not just healthcare, so its unusual to go from living comfortably to being on the street. Some argue the US way is good (more downward mobility is…
I live in London. Developed a persistent headache which goes on for a few months already. Just got appointment to a neurologist for August 2023. Today is September 2022. Although, is UK in Europe?...
No longer, because 350 million pounds a week was being diverted from the NHS into Brussels.
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#48Because that’s where all the money is. Seriously look at global GDP, maybe American citizens aren’t the wealthiest but the country and the businesses that run it sure as shit is.
Haha pay is higher in the US because, sure, it's the world's largest economy. Though there are more millionares being minted in China than in the US every year. Nevertheless I'd sure as shit not want to build my business in China. I used to think this was because of relatively higher taxes in the EU than in the US but at the top end the highest wage earners are taxed rather heavily. A 500k salary is not 500k takehome…
So, I'll be honest, taxes in the EU are (at the basic levels) near what they are in the US - top-line last-dollar percentage wise anyhow. But in the US there's a massive cottage industry in creating and managing deductions. I'm currently abroad, so while I'm subject to US taxes, the FEIE allows the first 112k to be deducted from income tax (not SS, so not everything but the bulk of it), and while I still expect to touch the 35% tax bracket on my last dollar earned this year, when you factor in the plethora of deductions, my effective tax rate is currently around 10%, and by year end will likely creep up to 17%.
I've lived in a few EU countries over the years, generally under digital nomad programs that exempt from local taxes - but it's still helpful by way of comparison, that right now, if I were to pay at the same rate in my current country, I'd be much closer to 30% than 20%.
Moreover, those earning substantially more than I am are largely not doing it as W2 (employees) or 1099 (contractors), but as investors earning capital gains - which themselves are taxed at a maximum of 20%.
You can add to the US burden state taxes, but some states don't tax income at all (Texas), or they do their taxation based off the federal AGI, so all of your deductions kick in for the state stuff as well.
If by some weird event I was earning 10x what I earn today, you can rest assured my tax rate in the US wouldn't go up from here, but instead it would be restructured into deferred capital gains (stock options), corporate ownership, investment in tax deferred or tax exempt accounts and so forth - because at the point where we're haggling over that much money, it's worth everyone's time to optimize even a 1% difference - by paying someone to do exactly that.
So yes, a 500k salary isn't 500k take home, but without doing anything different than what I'm doing today, it'd be pretty close to a 400k take-home under US tax law.
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#49Compared to Europe there is more upside and downside risk in the US. You can earn more but you are more likely to be financially wiped out if you get cancer or have an accident (high medical costs). Most countries in Europe have more social support built in at every level, not just healthcare, so its unusual to go from living comfortably to being on the street. Some argue the US way is good (more downward mobility is…
I live in London. Developed a persistent headache which goes on for a few months already. Just got appointment to a neurologist for August 2023. Today is September 2022. Although, is UK in Europe?...
Sounds typical UK. But, how much is your health insurance costing, and could you land a $500,000 bill if you go to the wrong hospital?
Re: Ask HN: Why is pay so much higher in the US? (or is it?)
#50I would really advise you to look into how stuff is organised in the US compared to your country. I once did and came to the conclusion that it looks like they earn more. I pay a really low healthcare insurance fee compared to the US. Their system for pension is also completely different from other countries. They have a 401K. In my case my company pays for my pension. I am Dutch from my stance it would be unwise to…
> They have a 401K. What would you prefer? Defined-benefits, dependent on your company managing your pension? Most people would rather it was independent and invested.
Well I am kind of unique and have a pension that is paid by my employer, and I have a personal pension (sort of a 401K). Do keep in mind that pension fund in the Netherlands are really well guarded (loads of laws). An employer or intermediary could never withdraw anything (neither can you unless you are at pension age).