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Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

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Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#391

Post by mynameisvlad »

layer8 wrote: post #364
lwhi wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fundamentally, because we are still worth something even when our achievements are completely removed. If you take the view that our achievements are necessarily integral to our self worth this logically isn't true.

> we are still worth something even when our achievements are completely removed. You can’t logically derive this from anything. It’s just a choice of how to see the world. “Worth” is inherently a subjective value judgement.

Who ever said it has to be logically derived?

Most of what we do and how we think is not “logically derived” and is extremely subjective; we’re human, not Vulcan.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#392

Post by EGreg »

_popcornLurker wrote: post #207
kukkeliskuu wrote: post #148

What you have encountered is actually one of the necessary steps to really become "a senior developer". And congratulations, you have already passed the biggest part of that hurdle: becoming aware of the issue. There are things that are fragile, things that break when they encounter a shock. Such as porcelain, when transported. There are things that are non-fragile, things that do not break when they encounter a simi…

Uhm...I have to chime in here. "Anti-fragile attitude" when it comes to criticism is not built by tolerance. Quite the opposite actually. It is a common misconception. While making yourself numb against criticism IS a solution but not by far the best one. A high criticism tolerance is learned by understanding that ones self worth is not attached to output or delivery. (This is hard in our industry) It comes from self…

Right. Consider whether this really impacts you as a person.

1) Who will see it? What will be the consequences? If no one, then look past the delivery and consider just the content.

2) Use it as useful feedback and information that you otherwise might have never gotten. Consider how many people may have thought similar things but were too nice to say anything. Finally someone spoke up and told you what others were thinking. Then you will come to regard the (private) exposing of a flaw with appreciation!

3) Treat it as you would any focus group, it is just one data point. Sometimes the frustrating thing is when the criticism is wrong and is just a product of how things are done locally. If you are un a full-time job, just embrace how things are done. If your solution serves many other clients, you may have to file it among other priorities.

When you start to focus on the work and the outcome, you don’t focus on criticism as a personal attack, even if it was meant as one you extract the actual usefulness from it.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#393

Post by sb8244 »

sverona wrote: post #375
layer8 wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You are not your lines of code. I think you actually are, in a very real sense. Someone else would have written different lines of codes. The lines of code are a function of yourself, an inherent part of you. Criticizing the lines of code criticizes that part of you. You can’t criticize a novel without implicitly criticizing its author. When we criticize an LLM’s output, we are typically criticizing the LLM. Percei…

By god, that's Deleuze's music! I disagree that the code I write is "part of me." It expresses a series of ideas that I had. And every therapeutic modality I have tried would have failed if I didn't have the implicit understanding that I have something like a soul or an essence that stands apart from my thoughts and feelings. My thoughts are just random noise in the grand scheme of things, including this sentence. I…

Sure you're not criticizing them as a person, but let's say they really like what they wrote. It's their masterpiece. Then someone comes in and says it's garbage that shouldn't have been written (intentionally using strong language because people do that).

I don't understand not feeling bummed out by that type of critique. Sure it's not about you as a person or your values, but dang that sucks.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#394

Post by jayroh »

shrimp_emoji wrote: post #331
_popcornLurker wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm...I have to chime in here. "Anti-fragile attitude" when it comes to criticism is not built by tolerance. Quite the opposite actually. It is a common misconception. While making yourself numb against criticism IS a solution but not by far the best one. A high criticism tolerance is learned by understanding that ones self worth is not attached to output or delivery. (This is hard in our industry) It comes from self…

Anecdotally, I had the opposite experience! > You'll find that the people that break down at the slightest criticism the most are those that were criticised the most as children as well. Those that had no room for being anything other than perfect. Where value was obtained from performance. My childhood fits this. > "Anti-fragile attitude" when it comes to criticism is not built by tolerance I DID learn these by tole…

I find this to be an incredibly well-balanced and mature measure of one's self. You should be proud that you were able to reach this level of self-reflection and clarity. Many people never get there, so kudos to you.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#396

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

chefandy wrote: post #390
_popcornLurker wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm...I have to chime in here. "Anti-fragile attitude" when it comes to criticism is not built by tolerance. Quite the opposite actually. It is a common misconception. While making yourself numb against criticism IS a solution but not by far the best one. A high criticism tolerance is learned by understanding that ones self worth is not attached to output or delivery. (This is hard in our industry) It comes from self…

A low self esteem from constant insults (aka non-constructive or overly harshly presented critique) or lack of encouragement will kill anybody's ability to accept useful feedback, and people can certainly become numb to that. However, that numbness is different than being unaccustomed to taking useful critique without getting defensive. Which is absolutely a learned skill– one of the most important you learn early in…

Agreed. The constructive vs insults is the important piece. My senior gives me useful feedback now a regular basis. I explicitly asked him to be as direct with me as he feels is necessary and it did open my eyes to the perception of my presentations among other things. To your point, I still bristle at a random unnecessary insult.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#397

Post by sb8244 »

layer8 wrote: post #359
_popcornLurker wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm...I have to chime in here. "Anti-fragile attitude" when it comes to criticism is not built by tolerance. Quite the opposite actually. It is a common misconception. While making yourself numb against criticism IS a solution but not by far the best one. A high criticism tolerance is learned by understanding that ones self worth is not attached to output or delivery. (This is hard in our industry) It comes from self…

> You are not your lines of code. I think you actually are, in a very real sense. Someone else would have written different lines of codes. The lines of code are a function of yourself, an inherent part of you. Criticizing the lines of code criticizes that part of you. You can’t criticize a novel without implicitly criticizing its author. When we criticize an LLM’s output, we are typically criticizing the LLM. Percei…

People are saying this isn't how it should be, but I want to share that this is closer to how I experience the world than not.

The attitude of desiring to learn is what keeps me sane, but I've learned that feedback like "X is bad" often comes from someone's subjective experiences in a particular situation. They then take that and apply it globally. It's hard to have conversation with such strong opinions.

Having a trusted coworker who has a disagreement, followed by a healthy conversation will result in either the change they want, the original staying, or a new solution that's better. Growth can come from all 3, depending on the mindset going in.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#398

Post by dom96 »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #281
dom96 wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The downside of internet fame to anyone is that you will attract far, far more of these people, regardless of what you do. Yeah... I don't consider myself to have "internet fame" but I suppose I'm well known enough in certain large communities that I've managed to attract these people. I've ended up leaving the communities where these people are active, but I have seen evidence that they continue to spout lies abou…

It seems to me that there are two cases here. In the first case, the community is healthy. In that case, someone spouting lies about someone who isn't even there anymore is going to look rather odd, especially if you had a history and a track record there. It has a good chance of not getting much traction, and it might get some pushback from the community. In this case you have a fair chance of being able to successf…

What you say makes sense and matches what my own thoughts around this subject have been. It definitely helps to hear it reaffirmed by others, so thank you.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#399

Post by srveale »

ethbr0 wrote: post #323
martypitt wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A high criticism tolerance is learned by understanding that ones self worth is not attached to output or delivery. > You are not your lines of code. These statements are sage advice. And while I believe them both to be correct, I personally struggle with remembering these things when it matters most.

The older I get, the more I'm convinced the secrets of life come in contradictory tuples, and the application of all elements at appropriate time and in appropriate ways. Zen koans were onto something. {"You are not your lines of code", "You should feel proud when your code is good and embarrassed when your code is bad"} Both of these things are true. To the matter at hand, how to take criticism constructively, the k…

> the secrets of life come in contradictory tuples

A great phrase for what I've been noticing about my life as well.

{"You should be okay with who you are", "You should always strive to be better"}, or {"Desire is the root of suffering", "Being passionate about a goal is the only way to fulfillment"}

Finding the nuances in these phrases and living in the bubbles where they are not actually contradictory has given me a lot of peace.

Re: Ask HN: How do you not take criticism of your work personally?

#400

Post by stonemetal12 »

haunter wrote: post #135
mnky9800n wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

George Lucas said that "you make a movie, given the circumstances". I really like that idea because it makes it immediately clear that your ideal of what you want to do, create, etc. Will change because of the chaos and unpredictability around you.

This is funny because he is the most infamous movie maker for changing movies over and over and over and over and over again (Star Wars). He took "given the circumstances" very liberally. Or another reading that "you make a movie" which never ever ends. https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_changes_in_Star_War...

Well, the circumstances changed, so he made a slightly different movie. ;)
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