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Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

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Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#361
Let me suggest an option that I haven't seen others bring up. One source of depression is that your expectations of what life and relationships should be like is all messed up. This comes from having a dysfunctional family growing up. There are many families that just weren't able to give emotional support in the way that the child needed. This leaves you with a twisted view of who you are and what you need in life.

As an aside, if you think talking about depression is hard, try getting people to admit that their parents were less than perfect. We were completely dependent on our parents growing up and we idolize them. People are imperfect. Parents are people. You can do the math from there, but it's still super hard to say out loud.

Adult Children of Alcoholics and Dysfunctional Families (commonly called ACA or ACoA) is a twelve step support group that focuses on this. They started because children of alcoholics were having a number of problems, even though they never touched alcohol themselves. Addiction was an obvious way for parents to be emotionally unavailable, but there are many other dysfunctions that affect children in a similar way. Search for the ACA Laundry List to see the common characteristics. If you relate to even half that list, then ACA will probably help you.

ACA is a support group. You can learn a lot just from reading the books, but there is more value in regularly talking to people who have dealt with the same issues. There are local groups in most areas (search for ACA groups), as well and zoom/phone groups.

There are many different approaches to therapy. If you are in the ACA category, then looking for a therapist that understands childhood trauma and neglect can be much more effective then the common CBT approach. Asking around at a group meeting can be useful to get references. A good group plus good therapy is more powerful than either alone.

I dealt with depression my whole life. I had some improvement with St John's Wort (a herbal SRRI), Vitamin D3, NAC, sleep, and exercise as others have already written about. But I had to discover ACA to get at the core issues.

If there is interest, I can post my list of ACA related books.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t really a charitable response imo

I believe it is the most charitable interpretation of the GGP: that OP is ignorant of their ignorance. They aren’t malicious, merely innocently unaware of how clueless they are on the subject. By the way, is the Hunt library still open 24x7? I remember it being a fun time when it was. Spent many a night there.

It is! I suffered through operating systems by way of Hunt ;)

If you were comp sci, Dr. Sturgill and Dr. Heckman are still making life hell for undergrads (for a good cause, of course)

Anyway, I see your point and don’t really have a better reply, so shrug I tend to agree that anything that can be attributed to ignorance rather than malice is correct, but the phrasing just seemed mildly aggressive to me. Not a big deal though!

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#363

Let me suggest an option that I haven't seen others bring up. One source of depression is that your expectations of what life and relationships should be like is all messed up. This comes from having a dysfunctional family growing up. There are many families that just weren't able to give emotional support in the way that the child needed. This leaves you with a twisted view of who you are and what you need in life.…

> Let me suggest an option that I haven't seen others bring up. One source of depression is that your expectations of what life and relationships should be like is all messed up. This comes from having a dysfunctional family growing up. There are many families that just weren't able to give emotional support in the way that the child needed. This leaves you with a twisted view of who you are and what you need in life.

> As an aside, if you think talking about depression is hard, try getting people to admit that their parents were less than perfect. We

Wow this hit me hard. Not because of my own expectations, but because of the expectations my ex had during our relationship, and looking at her family and their relationships it makes much more sense. You hit the nail on the head. Thanks for posting this.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#364
One reason i find these posts useful is if you are at wits end and desperate. My daughter has been diagnosed with depression (and ocd and anxiety). We have tried multiple medications, therapy (CBT, ERP), TMS(self paid because the f#ing insurance wont cover at the time), probiotics,.. Nothing has seemed to help. I look for any avenue that i can explore that brings her relief. Now i look at a comment for poor methylation and that is something we havent checked. Maybe it will help. As long as we always do it with medical professional advice, there is good in knowing the issues involved. No one cares more than the person and family suffering.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe it is the most charitable interpretation of the GGP: that OP is ignorant of their ignorance. They aren’t malicious, merely innocently unaware of how clueless they are on the subject. By the way, is the Hunt library still open 24x7? I remember it being a fun time when it was. Spent many a night there.

It is! I suffered through operating systems by way of Hunt ;) If you were comp sci, Dr. Sturgill and Dr. Heckman are still making life hell for undergrads (for a good cause, of course) Anyway, I see your point and don’t really have a better reply, so shrug I tend to agree that anything that can be attributed to ignorance rather than malice is correct, but the phrasing just seemed mildly aggressive to me. Not a big de…

Hahaha, classic. OS is a fun one.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#366

One reason i find these posts useful is if you are at wits end and desperate. My daughter has been diagnosed with depression (and ocd and anxiety). We have tried multiple medications, therapy (CBT, ERP), TMS(self paid because the f#ing insurance wont cover at the time), probiotics,.. Nothing has seemed to help. I look for any avenue that i can explore that brings her relief. Now i look at a comment for poor methylati…

That was my comment about methylation? It's currently at +1, maybe you upvoted to balance out a down-vote? ;)

How old is your daughter? Is she on birth control, either for being a fertile woman who doesn't want to be pregnant (i.e., to sabotage her fertility) or to treat dysmenorrhea?

My friend's health was sabotaged with depot provera, the time-release endocrine disruptor. Progesterone is a very important brain hormone. Progesterone USP is a synthetic version of what the body makes for itself.

Sometimes all a person needs to improve their metabolism is real b-vitamins from whole wheat sourdough bread (slow yeast -> natural b-vitamins, instead of synthetic b-vitamins).

You can contact me through Twitter - I have more ideas about solving depression. My username is at the bottom of my Mad In America essay (link in my other comment).

[edit]

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#367
post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never had a serious health issue, so maybe doctors are better with them, but my experience is doctors don't ask enough questions to find the best answers. Severe pain in testicles: ER doctor asks about blunt trauma, sees nothing, prescribes antibiotics. Family doctor later agrees. Year later, same pain! See a nurse-in-training, second question: "When was the last time you ejaculated?" ....oh... Sure enough, no a…

I'm sorry but you seem to have some really weird issues. Like "I worry about your executive function" weird.

Haha, thanks for your "concern". Spread over some 20-30 otherwise healthy active years, seems par for the course.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#368
Hello so the first thing you want to do is see a mental health professional and/or therapy. The second thing is, SSRIs tend to be pretty benign. I'm on Lexapro and the side effects are pretty tolerable and the benefits far outweigh the side effects. I wish you luck on this journey.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#369
post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So any support group is invalid then? AA? Smart Recovery? Addiction is a medical problem, so just talk to your doctor? If you have PTSD, don't talk to other people with PTSD, just isolate and talk to your doctor? If you have depression, don't talk to other people who have had depression, who might make you feel less alone, just talk to your doctor? Think through what you're saying.

Those support groups don't give advice about medicine.

Um, they kinda do. In my experience it's generally not "advice" in the same way a doctor gives it, but it's been more along the lines of, "I took X. Y happened." Not, "You should (not) take X because it (worked/didn't work) for me".

People keep saying we should _normalize_ talking about mental health, and what you're suggesting goes against that. If we were discussing heart health and someone were to talk about their exercise, diet and medication online, would you say, "Hey, wait a minute! You're not a doctor. You can't say that." Of course not. What you're advocating for is an overly paternalistic approach to mental health issues, as if people are too dumb to listen to different viewpoints and come to their own conclusions.

Re: Ask HN: Beating depression with or without anti-depressants?

#370
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, you are very very wrong about this. Have you ever talked to a _medical_ professional about depression or any mental health issue? They generally don't know what they're doing. Medical professionals only have one tool in their arsenal for depression: antidepressants. So a medical doctor will likely prescribe them, whether that's appropriate or not. Antidepressants are no joke. Sometimes they can help, but they…

You're a frontend engineer, not a doctor. You're not qualified to give advice on medicine.

You are an engineer and not a public health researcher. You are not qualified to give advice on whether consulting a doctor is the right course of action.
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