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Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

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Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#31
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"yet our frontend code is reactjs without typescript" I don't blame them. I hate Typescript. Worked on projects at a major gaming company, no typescript necessary.

Of course your opinions are your opinions. However, if the JS build system was actually sane, TS would be the default choice. It's a superset of JS, so saying no typescript necessary is like saying a horse gets me from a to b, no need for cars. TS is objectively better for many use cases and situation if you spend an hour learning it without all the build tooling nonsense getting in the way. It's equivalent to a comp…

Eh, I just didn't need it.

I learned it but never saw the need for the extra overhead.

It's full of these situations. And I'd rather just see less code due to "Attention Economy" issues-- the more things to focus on, the less focus each thing receives. It's easier on the big picture, if there's less things going on. TS has a ton of terms and concepts that I just don't need to make my business logic work.

const cat Cat cat = cat

vs.

const cat = cat

dto? iterface? i can define those without typescript. Just plain objects with comments about what they do and what they are.

Anyway, yep it's just my personal opinion of course.

My opinion is basically... I think in some cases there's a desire to make things overly complex, sometimes even as a way to gate keep--

I'm not saying that's what is happening here.

But sometimes I feel that way about Typescript leaking into all of the Javascript ecosystem.

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#32
If you ask such question it means you are not good.

So you want to find some niche where it is easier?

I’d say double down on being good or really good at your stack and you will have profitable opportunities anyway.

Mind you I am not writing that you have to be super good - just be good and deliver what you promise. Stack does not matter that much.

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#33
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course your opinions are your opinions. However, if the JS build system was actually sane, TS would be the default choice. It's a superset of JS, so saying no typescript necessary is like saying a horse gets me from a to b, no need for cars. TS is objectively better for many use cases and situation if you spend an hour learning it without all the build tooling nonsense getting in the way. It's equivalent to a comp…

Eh, I just didn't need it. I learned it but never saw the need for the extra overhead. It's full of these situations. And I'd rather just see less code due to "Attention Economy" issues-- the more things to focus on, the less focus each thing receives. It's easier on the big picture, if there's less things going on. TS has a ton of terms and concepts that I just don't need to make my business logic work. const cat Ca…

Fair enough. Idk who downvoted me, but based on your reasonable response, doesn't seem like it was you.

Ultimately, TS enforces those implicit comments you mentioned and adds some explicitness to the code.

Whatever works for you and gets your job done

But it's worth mentioning, TS with some of the strict settings disabled is basically JS but with some added benefits, primarily due to the TS type checker still being available. No need to go fully in, you can just as easily add explicitness and overhead where necessary and write JS everywhere else to avoid the overhead.

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#34
Definitely not. Maybe there's a lot of competition for full stack jobs, but at least in Vancouver, that's increasingly where more of the demand is.

Most companies have let people go, stopped hiring, or reduced the rate at which their headcount increases. Whether it's a good idea or not, that puts more companies in the spot of needing 1 engineer to do the work of 2, and the simplest way people see to do that is hiring full stack developers.

Even full stack aside, it makes hiring easier if I can keep hiring JavaScript engineers instead of needing some JavaScript, some Java. Companies all around the world need web apps and apps built, and will for a long time to come, and more and more of them are moving to a majority-Js(/TS) stack.

It's not like COBOL where you have systems which need maintenance and a retiring generation of engineers. There are still an abundance of java or C# or sql devs out there.

Do what you love, and if that's c#, go for it. But if I had no preference, I would go deep on JavaScript.

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#35
post #2

maybe anecdotal but in my experience there is no saturation in devs who are doing things properly. im in a multinational company in a billion dollar industry yet our frontend code is reactjs without typescript, eslint misconfigured, stylelint not used, bad practices on use of react hooks, and many more. there are teams and devs that are out of touch on maximizing what tools are available out there. im not even saying…

My perception is that the vast majority of employers are lacking either the will or the experience to recognize skilled developers and the value of their skill. In other words, skill depth is borderline meaningless in job-hunting, as opposed to skill breadth. Do you think that perception is exaggerated/pessimistic?

Skill depth is hard to test in an interview, and arguably less valuable in the long run for an organisation than other skills (communication, learns quickly, takes ownership etc.).

Skill can be taught

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#36
post #20

As a hiring manager who looks at a lot of resumes, I think your hunch is correct. I see a lot of junior to mid-level developers that primarily work in JS/TS/React. That market is heavily saturated and I regularly read posts on LinkedIn from these people about how difficult it is to find a job. The candidates that stand out from the pack are those with some tangible production backend experience in languages like C#,…

What are you hiring for? JavaScript doesn't just mean frontend.

I am much more interested in how people pick up new tech and interesting projects than the specifics of the language. With modern libraries and frameworks I don't think you need deep experts in particular languages anymore

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#37
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, I just didn't need it. I learned it but never saw the need for the extra overhead. It's full of these situations. And I'd rather just see less code due to "Attention Economy" issues-- the more things to focus on, the less focus each thing receives. It's easier on the big picture, if there's less things going on. TS has a ton of terms and concepts that I just don't need to make my business logic work. const cat Ca…

Fair enough. Idk who downvoted me, but based on your reasonable response, doesn't seem like it was you. Ultimately, TS enforces those implicit comments you mentioned and adds some explicitness to the code. Whatever works for you and gets your job done But it's worth mentioning, TS with some of the strict settings disabled is basically JS but with some added benefits, primarily due to the TS type checker still being a…

Nah twas not I.

While working with TS in VS Code, I liked the intellisense of TypeScript + VSCode... it was able to piece itself together better than vanilla JS-- it predicted which objects, functions, or files I would reference quite well. So, I'll give it that.

I totally see a reason for it in the corporate realm of developer churn and in the vein of keeping projects very structured and stable. I might give it another go eventually.

For my own projects where I try to keep mental overhead low, and reduce focus on anything over than the main business logic, I prefer plain JS (e.g. within an ExpressJS or ReactJS project)

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#38

JavaScript gives you access to a large pool, and while there are a lot of people fishing in that pool, you can use soft skills to dramatically increase your odds there. I get work in part because I can work with TypeScript, though I have many other languages and hard skills. It’s also because I’m a strong communicator, I can organize my thoughts and plans well in lay terms, and I have particularly sharp empathy for w…

This is sound advice!

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#39
post #19

The JS world makes my head spin - can't properly keep up with best practices and tools. I've always seen iOS and Android development as being very secure and some of the hardest positions to fill.

Would you say it's worth getting into native Android development as a junior or they only want seniors to fill these positions.

Java experience has the benefit of getting you into enterprise backend, which pays well and isn't going away anytime soon.

Re: Ask HN: Should I move away from JavaScript based skillset because of saturation?

#40
post #20

As a hiring manager who looks at a lot of resumes, I think your hunch is correct. I see a lot of junior to mid-level developers that primarily work in JS/TS/React. That market is heavily saturated and I regularly read posts on LinkedIn from these people about how difficult it is to find a job. The candidates that stand out from the pack are those with some tangible production backend experience in languages like C#,…

What are you hiring for? JavaScript doesn't just mean frontend. I am much more interested in how people pick up new tech and interesting projects than the specifics of the language. With modern libraries and frameworks I don't think you need deep experts in particular languages anymore

> JavaScript doesn't just mean frontend.

I would assume they know that. There are plenty of projects that don't have nodejs backends.

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