Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

news.ycombinator.com

31–40 of 62 posts

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://yoshuabengio.org/2023/05/22/how-rogue-ais-may-arise/

Thank you for the reference. Its author defines a "rogue AI" as: "an autonomous AI system that could behave in ways that would be catastrophically harmful to a large fraction of humans, potentially endangering our societies and even our species or the biosphere" and explains that it would also need to be goal-directed in a way which would be at odds with human wellbeing. Stipulating all that, what is still missing is…

> How is it supposed to affect the world outside its computing substrate? Absent humans making available the interfaces and resources to do so, it can't.

True, but what more do you need than the ability to send web requests to arbitrary domains, and receive the responses?

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#32

I think it's very hard to see what happens when these things can handle video and become truly multi-model. you would get a very powerful world model, I think. There don't seem to be any sensors you can't hook them up to. could it learn to infer left from right, object permanence, things like falling and gravity? Another thing to look at is large organizations accomplish much more than any individual in them, even th…

What things specifically? LLMs?

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#33

> sober voices as Geoffrey Hinton sounding the alarm about super-smart AI Can someone please explain to me what exactly the danger is / the dangers are of "super-intelligent" AI? AIUI, an AI is a combination of hardware, software and parametrization. In broad terms, it exists as a black box which supplies to humans responses to token sets fed to it. Even if an AI has the launch codes for ICBMs somewhere in its traini…

I used to wonder the same, and was dismissive of the idea of "superintelligence". Now I think the whole thing- superintelligence, alignment, etc-, can be simplified a lot. Imagine you could give to someone (a random human being) the gift of omnipotence. Would you trust anyone with this ultimate power? That's the whole problem.

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#34
You ask a very pointed question and after reading the various responses given, I think it is quite obvious that many have forgotten a very simple rule from decades ago: Garbage In -> Garbage Out.

Two things to consider:

1). No computer system will ever go beyond its programming and for an artificial intelligence of any sort, this will be required.

I have worked in many systems over the last 40 years and all too often, when you are forced by circumstance or direction, the analysis of those systems have been shown to be essentially garbage presenting what appears to be reasonable results when those results are not at all reasonable.

2). No matter how much data we "feed" these systems, the data will contain rubbish in terms of what we are trying to do with it and this leads only to further rubbish being created.

What we need to be cognisant of in regards to these technologies is that they are or will be used by people who do not understand the limitations of these technologies and will believe they are far more capable than they really are.

I don't disagree that these tools can be or will be useful as an adjunct to our capabilities. But unless we are actually stupid, we should not be relying on these systems for critical purposes. Of course, this will happen as it has already happened many times in the past and we have suffered from the inherent stupidity involved - we (as humanity) are just too lazy in so many ways.

I have the privilege of watching my 5 month old granddaughter grow and when you see the intelligence inherent here and then compare with so called machine intelligence, you quickly realise that all of our efforts in machine intelligence development is nothing compared to what we see in the development of intelligence in human beings.

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#35
Should we be making a distinction between sufficiently-intelligent and super-intelligent? It seems like the near term concern would be sufficiently-intelligent. We can all agree that marketing, while currently crude, does have an effect. Some people are more swayed than others by bought-and-paid-for messages. But right now mass-marketing is pretty lowest-common-denominator. What happens when it gets cheap enough to dedicate one-humanish-intelligence 24/7 dedicated to learning about how to influence you to buy or vote. Monitoring what you look at online, where you go, people you frequently engage with, etc., and customizing/"fabricating" interesting "news" to consume, etc.. And then what happens when it is a trivial cost to put 1,000 human-intelligences working against you?

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://yoshuabengio.org/2023/05/22/how-rogue-ais-may-arise/

Thank you for the reference. Its author defines a "rogue AI" as: "an autonomous AI system that could behave in ways that would be catastrophically harmful to a large fraction of humans, potentially endangering our societies and even our species or the biosphere" and explains that it would also need to be goal-directed in a way which would be at odds with human wellbeing. Stipulating all that, what is still missing is…

Kinda like ChatGPT hired a person to just pass captchas, or Sydney reading news about it's own actions/interactions and therefore getting info it shouldn't have had, there's a lot of space for going out of the guardrails of not having a proper interface

Too many systems rely on people being unaware of exploits, but an AI would never forget something, or get bored or tired of trying, It doesn't need to be smarter than humans, just have enough persistence and attention to detail

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> s haven’t tried GPT-4 or they have and are just stubbornly refusing to change their mind about something when presented with new evidence. Have you considered that the evidence just isn't convincing yet? If you view popular llms as text prediction machines, they are in fact much better than spell check or auto correct from a few years ago. But if you actually ask it to solve the problem with nuance it will not use…

I had it extract some general rules from this page and pasted them below: https://video.stackexchange.com/questions/26302/ffmpeg-cutti... USER given the following general rules: 1. The issue described in the text occurs when cutting a video between keyframes, resulting in blank video with original sound. 2. Potential solutions include overlaying the copied part with a few seconds of the re-encoded original, seeking t…

I'm not sure what you thought I meant. Or what this is supposed to show. If you tell your text prediction engine to make sure to account for keyframes. It's not impressive that it responds with how to account for them. I know it can use ffmpeg, I haven't seen it attempt to account for well known edge cases, or caveats they way a real expert trying to be helpful would.

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#38
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> s haven’t tried GPT-4 or they have and are just stubbornly refusing to change their mind about something when presented with new evidence. Have you considered that the evidence just isn't convincing yet? If you view popular llms as text prediction machines, they are in fact much better than spell check or auto correct from a few years ago. But if you actually ask it to solve the problem with nuance it will not use…

ChatGPT with GPT-4 with just "how to use ffmpeg to slice out a video" pasted directly from your comment without any additional prompting or clarification brought up your point about the keyframes. So whatever you think you're criticising isn't the same thing that I'm using. Kind of demonstrates my point that you're either using an older version or choosing to ignore evidence for some reason.

It doesn't impress me that once corrected (which it has been multiple times), that it stops giving wrong answers. If it was able to detect and supply nuance to something novel. Then I might be impressed.

BTW: when I posed this question

> how do I use ffmpeg to slice out a video, I only want 3 seconds of video from the middle

to chatgpt4, it did not mention anything about accounting for keyframes. So I'm not sure what version you're using, but it's not the one I have access to :/ Another reason to assume good faith, because you seem to have access to something that I don't.

And, this is now (well before this specific conversation) an expired example because openai's model has been specifically training on this nuance, and thus even if it never made a mistake around it, it still wouldn't be impressive to me; simply because this nuance was directly added to it's model. Remember, we're talking about if the abilities of available models are impressive, what would be impressive to me is if they're able to generalize well enough to know things they haven't been directly taught.

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#39
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ChatGPT with GPT-4 with just "how to use ffmpeg to slice out a video" pasted directly from your comment without any additional prompting or clarification brought up your point about the keyframes. So whatever you think you're criticising isn't the same thing that I'm using. Kind of demonstrates my point that you're either using an older version or choosing to ignore evidence for some reason.

It doesn't impress me that once corrected (which it has been multiple times), that it stops giving wrong answers. If it was able to detect and supply nuance to something novel. Then I might be impressed. BTW: when I posed this question > how do I use ffmpeg to slice out a video, I only want 3 seconds of video from the middle to chatgpt4, it did not mention anything about accounting for keyframes. So I'm not sure what…

I watched some flat earthers in debates, and they seemed to revel in their freedom to not be impressed by their opponents arguments. It seemed like a kind of rush for them, like a kind of power trip, that was more intense the stronger their opponents arguments. Like a kind of 'no matter how strong your argument is you can't make me agree with you' power trip.

Re: Ask HN: Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

#40
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't impress me that once corrected (which it has been multiple times), that it stops giving wrong answers. If it was able to detect and supply nuance to something novel. Then I might be impressed. BTW: when I posed this question > how do I use ffmpeg to slice out a video, I only want 3 seconds of video from the middle to chatgpt4, it did not mention anything about accounting for keyframes. So I'm not sure what…

I watched some flat earthers in debates, and they seemed to revel in their freedom to not be impressed by their opponents arguments. It seemed like a kind of rush for them, like a kind of power trip, that was more intense the stronger their opponents arguments. Like a kind of 'no matter how strong your argument is you can't make me agree with you' power trip.

I don't mean to imply that I'm attempting to not be impressed. Before writing the comment you replied to, I asked a friend who is enamored by the new abilities how I would know my mental model for how it works, and what it's able to do is wrong. If I'm wrong, missing something, or making a mistake. I'd like to know about it. Outside of that, the context for the whole discussion is

> Why do so many assume we’re on the cusp of super-intelligent AI?

And how "smart" text to text engines can become.

My argument is actually pretty close to yours. People that are impressed, want to be. They're looking for ways to be impressed. Just like you think I'm looking for ways not to be impressed. Which, even if I am, it still should be easy to convince me (or others) that super-intelligent AI is coming soon to an API near you!

Right now, the LLMs that are the new hotness, aren't super intelligent. They're not domain experts, they can't play a simple game that children love without cheating. They're easily distracted if you know how to word a question correctly. While it's cool they can generate language that seems to be true, and useful. It's not as useful as what already exists. (For the context that I care about) And, all of these examples are markers of below average intelligence. What's the argument that would convince me that very soon, we'll take something stupid and make it hyper-intelligent? Because that's no something I've seen happen before.

Still, all of that said. Your comment that seems clearly meant to be insulting, doesn't actually make any other point. Did you mean to imply something else? Or was it just an attempt to throw insults by pretending to make an observation? Because the conversation is about if people should be impressed. Which when it comes down to it an opinion, are opinions bad?

Post reply on HN