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Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

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Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#31

Post by kramerger »

bartminton wrote: post #21
giantg2 wrote: post #11

"politics, social life, social net" I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. I think it will be difficult to recommend a place with low taxes and robust safety net. Generally the taxes are what Pay for a safety net. On that note, the US could be an option (southern states) for you since the taxes tend to be lower than other developed nations. The safety net is fairly robust, bu…

> "politics, social life, social net" > I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. We're both educated and open towards a liberal, future oriented society. Same goes for paying taxes, since the "overall standards" in Germany are still very high. Nevertheless, the last 10 years spit society, family and friends. Hardly any healthy discussion culture, you're either on the one or the…

> which to us especially means escaping crazy black/white discussions,

But the decision to leave instead of trying to engage and improve things is pretty black and white mentality in itself, isn't it?

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#32

Post by bartminton »

theriddlr wrote: post #25

Malaysia or Singapore (island on the equator). Spain Balearics or Canary Islands.

We've traveled to Malaysia and Singapore. Climate-wise both fine, we're just not sure, how easy it is, for Europeans to establish there. Spain is an option, but especially Gran Canaria is on top of our list, I lived there for a while and really enjoyed it. Thanks for your recommendations!

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#33

Post by itake »

theriddlr wrote: post #25

Malaysia or Singapore (island on the equator). Spain Balearics or Canary Islands.

All the expats I've talked to in Singapore (which is 5+) from Europe and US complain Singapore is too small and doesn't provide enough entertainment. So they get bored and leave after 3-5 years.

I used to live in Southeast Asia and learned you can never truly feel at home due to visa rules and the homogeneous culture.

I loved my time there and encourage others to go, but I'd caution if you're trying to throw down roots.

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#34

Post by bartminton »

kramerger wrote: post #31
bartminton wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "politics, social life, social net" > I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. We're both educated and open towards a liberal, future oriented society. Same goes for paying taxes, since the "overall standards" in Germany are still very high. Nevertheless, the last 10 years spit society, family and friends. Hardly any healthy discussion culture, you're either on the one or the…

> which to us especially means escaping crazy black/white discussions, But the decision to leave instead of trying to engage and improve things is pretty black and white mentality in itself, isn't it?

> But the decision to leave instead of trying to engage and improve things is pretty black and white mentality in itself, isn't it?

You've got a point here. Yes, it's giving up. And to be honest, we both gave up. But since we're responsible for our little one, we still try to make the best of it, hence want to restart somewhere else. But I get your point. It's just that we both spent all of our energy over the last 25 years to improve things in all sorts of different dimensions and simply ran out of "mana".

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#35

Post by ktzar »

bartminton wrote: post #21
giantg2 wrote: post #11

"politics, social life, social net" I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. I think it will be difficult to recommend a place with low taxes and robust safety net. Generally the taxes are what Pay for a safety net. On that note, the US could be an option (southern states) for you since the taxes tend to be lower than other developed nations. The safety net is fairly robust, bu…

> "politics, social life, social net" > I think it will be hard to recommend depending on your exact positions on these. We're both educated and open towards a liberal, future oriented society. Same goes for paying taxes, since the "overall standards" in Germany are still very high. Nevertheless, the last 10 years spit society, family and friends. Hardly any healthy discussion culture, you're either on the one or the…

I feel you, but I'd recommend taking a step back, breath in, breath out, look at the government budget, and realise that the plans you may not agree with your government only add up to 1% of those "hard earned taxes".

Somehow, in the era with universal access to raw data discussions seem to never have been so polarised. But I'm afraid that's the same anywhere :-(

I still there's a few places better than Germany to live, even more if you've started a family.

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#36

Post by jaclaz »

badpun wrote: post #10
jaclaz wrote: post #6

You are more or less describing the Canary Islands. You can live there talking English only, and there will be probably opportunities of work for your wife (that should however learn to speak at least functional Spanish). Remote working for you, however, I don't think there is much occupation related to your field.

Are Spanish taxes lower than German?

Generally speaking yes (a little), but as always it depends, should be lower for low/medium income but higher for higher incomes.

Canary Islands (though part of Spain) are a "special territory", and have some different tax rules from Spain:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_member_state_territori...

VAT is different and there are some subsidies for (say) establishing a company there if you employ locals.

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#37

Post by tobylane »

bartminton wrote: post #27
Matthias247 wrote: post #23

Having moved from germany to canada (Vancouver BC) in 2017, I can tell you that "quality of life" is highly subjective, and a lot of things in germany work far better than it seems - but you will only notice it if you have anything to compare against. E.g. [online] shopping and stock availability is so much better in germany, and you only notice what a privilege it is to get everything you need in 1 day once it's tak…

You touch a number of very important points here. Thanks for that. We're aware of the fact, that the overall situation in many countries in the world is much, much worse. So it's kind of a luxury problem. What is actually a challenge, is that I work as a freelancer for 20 years now and still have to go a long way to secure my private pension. I once calculated my personal "real" tax rate in Germany, and ended up at a…

Can you share your working out for the “real” tax rate? We could see how various US states, first world countries vary. Does knowing that the lowest state is say 50% make it easier to pick Portugal at say 60%?

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#38

Post by theriddlr »

itake wrote: post #33
theriddlr wrote: post #25

Malaysia or Singapore (island on the equator). Spain Balearics or Canary Islands.

All the expats I've talked to in Singapore (which is 5+) from Europe and US complain Singapore is too small and doesn't provide enough entertainment. So they get bored and leave after 3-5 years. I used to live in Southeast Asia and learned you can never truly feel at home due to visa rules and the homogeneous culture. I loved my time there and encourage others to go, but I'd caution if you're trying to throw down roo…

What kind of entertainment? I find entertainment in Singapore is very 'manufactured' and prefer the UK. People don't have to be limited to Singapore, travelling to other Asian countries is very cheap.

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#39

Post by silisili »

Countries that often seem idyllic on paper often have some rather bad downsides - definitely do your research without blinders on. I've done small stints(long vacations, not work) in a couple island places that seem nice, but healthcare is terrible, white people perhaps are treated differently, etc etc. And even in places with better-ish healthcare, a lot of times there's some resentment from people like us driving up their house prices and such.

Are you considering the US? There's a few states that would meet your criteria of weather. You'd really want to talk to some people privately regarding what you want and politics - California and Florida could not be further apart WRT the people, beliefs, and governments.

Re: Ask HN: Leaving Germany – where to find quality of life as experienced engineer?

#40

Post by jacquesm »

As a multiple-times-emigrant I can tell you this one thing: no matter where you go, it will be plusses and minuses compared to where you are originally from. Some things will be better, others will be worse. Sometimes much better and sometimes much worse. And there is no way to know this up front you just need to go there and live there for a while before your own personal scorebook can be updated, other people will have an entirely different view on these things depending on their own background, stage of life they are in, personality and so on.

Whatever you will end up finding: it will make you a more balanced person and better able to appreciate the good and the bad of where ever you are in a much more objective way than before.

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