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Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

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Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#31
post #23

Some things that have been extremely useful for me: Play video games that require intense focus for prolonged durations to perform well like Starcraft 2, CSGO, DOTA 2 helped me build mental endurance. Reduce social media. I’ve found that this was the most productive. Social media was fragmenting my attention by making me anxious and addicted. After I reduced Reddit and Facebook usage, my mental discipline increased d…

The problem with those games is that it is easy to spend a full day playing them:

- StarCraft tries to keep your win rate at 50%, so a lot of the time you will find yourself frustrated.

- DotA games can be really long, and some people get really upset.

Now, I recommend you write down how you feel before playing these games, and how you feel after. And try to see if it helps.

Do you feel ready to study or work on a side project for 6 hours? I doubt so. You will probably feel ready for another match, and another, and another.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#32
It was already mentioned in a sub-comment, but I think it deserves a more thoughtful top-level comment and a little bit of personal anecdote. (Edit to clarify: more thoughtful than the other top-level comment; the sub-comment was also very thoughtful. Edit 2 to add: another good top-level comment addressed this possibility while I was writing this response.)

I would seriously encourage you to consider an evaluation for ADHD, if you have not already. Easily giving up when confronted with challenges is a classic ADHD behavior, and it's often described and perceived as laziness. Having greater success under higher pressure is a classic trait as well.

I'm (obviously) not qualified to diagnose you, but I recognized something of myself in your description of the difficulties you're facing (so much so that the first thing I did before typing was find-in-page for ADHD just to see what had already been discussed).

It's possible the tendency to retreat from challenges is part of a feedback loop. You mention that your confidence suffers. This is more likely to discourage you from facing future challenges. Each challenge feels a little more out of reach, and each consequence increases the pressure.

One thing that a lot of undiagnosed adults don't know is that ADHD can present like as anxiety and depression. It can also look like fear and apathy. It's hard to spot, because we're accustomed to childhood symptoms, which are often a lot more disruptive.

If it helps encourage you to consult with your doctor (if you haven't already): a little over a year ago I was diagnosed. I've been adjusting treatment over that time, and it's still not perfect, but in that time I went from an anxious falling apart mess grateful to have a job at all, to taking on leadership of a team. (Obviously, a great deal of other things have improved along with that, but I'm trying to stay relevant to the question.) Side effects of my particular med (currently vyvanse) are non-existent, I'm just gradually working up to a dose that works for me. Even times of greater stress don't discourage me (though they can require more recovery time, but... that's normal?). There's been literally no downside.

Like I said, I'm in no way offering a diagnosis, but I would seriously encourage seeing someone who can. And if you're going that route, I'd also encourage doing some reading on how ADHD affects/presents in adults. The DSM is... well, entirely geared toward childhood diagnosis, and your doctor may rely on that.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#33
I have one piece of advice outside the usual- routine, planning, regular breaks:

When you do settle on a task that you want to complete, don't urinate- just wait- hold it for longer than is comfortable. Kinda weird and personal, but urgency is a mental burden to overcome. Every task is more difficult to focus on when you've got to take a whizz.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#34
post #23

Some things that have been extremely useful for me: Play video games that require intense focus for prolonged durations to perform well like Starcraft 2, CSGO, DOTA 2 helped me build mental endurance. Reduce social media. I’ve found that this was the most productive. Social media was fragmenting my attention by making me anxious and addicted. After I reduced Reddit and Facebook usage, my mental discipline increased d…

Genuinely curious, does playing video games really improve focus etc.? Is this anecdotal, or did you read some paper somewhere?

Sorry, don’t have any specific papers for you, but if you google around you’ll find the general consensus is if you’re forced to focus on any mentally straining task for a prolonged period, it’ll generally help your mental abilities.

If the game is challenging for you, it will likely help.

Check out neuroscience books if you want to be deep in this stuff.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#35
I'm going to guess that you're going to get more mileage out of cutting something out of your life than in adopting yet another mindset, habit, drug or whatever. Some possible things that might work:

* youtube/netflix

* social media

* news

* sugar

* video games

These are the things your brain goes towards automatically as an easier "win" than in facing the harder problem. Cutting them out will leave room for you to face harder challenges.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#36

There is the potential that you have ADHD, because what you're describing sounds similar to my situation. I eventually ended up on stimulant medication to help, but there's non-stimulant medication available (if you're opposed to eating amphetamines for breakfast), as well as counselling and other treatment options that don't involve medication. Even if you don't want to seek professional treatment, you could look up…

Looks like you posted while I was writing my response, and another has chimed in on this sub-thread. I expect a bunch of us will recognize ourselves a bit in this AskHN.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#37
Your questions are answered in the thread, which is a pretty significant feat to overcome (I ditto the pomodoro method, exercise, and higher expectations). That said, laziness is not all bad. Keep some of it in case you need it. Given sufficient motivation, I recommend aligning your productivity with meaningful outcomes. If you can't, you will be back here looking for another solution in not much time with a bigger problem. But then again, there are worse things in life than being lazy.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#38
Take a look at Dr peterson personality test 'understand myself'. Maybe you have a open personality also named creative and it often work in opposition do industriousness.

In that case maybe your are more suited to chaotic endeavor where you can thrive in the unexpected while other drown into it.

Let's say you get a new job, are you at your best at the beginning where everything is new or have you better energy when things are settled and in theirs place ?

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#39
post #23

Some things that have been extremely useful for me: Play video games that require intense focus for prolonged durations to perform well like Starcraft 2, CSGO, DOTA 2 helped me build mental endurance. Reduce social media. I’ve found that this was the most productive. Social media was fragmenting my attention by making me anxious and addicted. After I reduced Reddit and Facebook usage, my mental discipline increased d…

>Play video games that require intense focus for prolonged durations to perform well like Starcraft 2, CSGO, DOTA 2 helped me build mental endurance.

Don't do that. These games are exactly the core of my own mental laziness.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#40

There is the potential that you have ADHD, because what you're describing sounds similar to my situation. I eventually ended up on stimulant medication to help, but there's non-stimulant medication available (if you're opposed to eating amphetamines for breakfast), as well as counselling and other treatment options that don't involve medication. Even if you don't want to seek professional treatment, you could look up…

Someone doesn’t have to have ADHD to shirk from hard problems. Expecting technical/intellectual problems to be easy to solve is something that is drilled into most people by the school system, which rarely if ever present problems that take more than a few minutes to solve, and pretty much never expect students to try tackling problems that require weeks of effort. The result is that when many people encounter a hard…

> Someone doesn’t have to have ADHD to shirk from hard problems.

At least 3-4 people with ADHD have already spotted the potential, and I expect that more will while the question is up. You're right that it doesn't have to be ADHD, but I don't really see the value in dismissing it either.

Edit:

> There is probably an influence from inherent personality differences, but I would speculate that building up stamina for tackling hard problems comes down substantially to practice.

For those of us who do have a chemical imbalance, many of us have coping mechanisms which look a lot like building up this stamina. But it's important to understand that this can come very unnaturally for some people and be considerably more difficult and unstable.

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