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Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

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Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#31

Post by run4yourlives »

mrtron wrote: post #19
thingsilearned wrote: post #11

If you want to first learn the fundamentals, PHP/MySQL is a good place to start. If you want to just jump in and make something frameworks such as Django and Rails make a nice level of abstraction above the database and even above the raw HTML. If you're looking for a recommendation, I love Django.

My brother was a hacker in the late 90s, early 00s. He has a massive online hockey pool that he created somewhere around 98 or 99, all wrote in php. He wants to revamp the site, which he hasn't fundamentally changed in 5 years or more, and asked me what to suggest. 'python manage.py inspectdb', the built in admin, and clean separation between code and style converted him to Django.

What's he re-vamping and why?

Look and feel? No need to switch from PHP. Performance? A framework might help, but it might not. Maintenance time? Could be looking ground up here.

Again, if this is a redesign for the sake of redesigning, it doesn't really matter what you use. If there is a specific goal though, changing frameworks/languages should only be done if it provides a way to reach the goal.

Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#32

Post by chaostheory »

I posted this before, but I can't find the link in YC...

If time is critical, then I figure you'll want screencasts for the language/framework you need to use.

I don't know of any that exist for any other language/framework, but Ruby on Rails has really excellent ones at:

http://peepcode.com - not free but no one else compresses an entire Rails book in 5 hours of video

http://railscasts.com - 5 to 15 min useful segments related to ruby on rails

Once you feel a little more comfortable after viewing the videos, the Pragmatic Programmer Series and Oreilly books are a good place to continue.

Almost forgot - you can test out all you learned at (YC startup) http://heroku.com (nothing to install on your computer - easy to start)

Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#33

Post by mrtron »

run4yourlives wrote: post #31
mrtron wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My brother was a hacker in the late 90s, early 00s. He has a massive online hockey pool that he created somewhere around 98 or 99, all wrote in php. He wants to revamp the site, which he hasn't fundamentally changed in 5 years or more, and asked me what to suggest. 'python manage.py inspectdb', the built in admin, and clean separation between code and style converted him to Django.

What's he re-vamping and why? Look and feel? No need to switch from PHP. Performance? A framework might help, but it might not. Maintenance time? Could be looking ground up here. Again, if this is a redesign for the sake of redesigning, it doesn't really matter what you use. If there is a specific goal though, changing frameworks/languages should only be done if it provides a way to reach the goal.

He is rewriting the site. Why? Because he wants to add a bunch of new features that would take longer to hack into the old system then to rewrite an entire new system. He is open to learning some new things, hence the language switch.

He isn't switching for the sake of redesigning, I don't know how you got that impression.

Maintenance time is a key factor here - he rarely looks at the code, so PHP-spaghetti (we are talking '99 PHP, pre-OO and basically impossible to not create spaghetti) is getting unbearable.

Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#34

Post by jamesbritt »

thingsilearned wrote: post #11

If you want to first learn the fundamentals, PHP/MySQL is a good place to start. If you want to just jump in and make something frameworks such as Django and Rails make a nice level of abstraction above the database and even above the raw HTML. If you're looking for a recommendation, I love Django.

"If you want to first learn the fundamentals, PHP/MySQL is a good place to start."

Why, given the existence of Rails, Django, TurboGears, Ramaze, Merb, etc.?

Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#35

Post by nreece »

rodrigo wrote: post #21
nreece wrote: post #16

You may as well start with JSP at a free web host like http://www.myjavaserver.com/ or http://www.eatj.com/ to play around.

Are there anything like this for python (w/wo django)?

Have a look at http://wiki.python.org/moin/FreeHosts

Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#36

Post by flashgordon »

Yeah its a slow transition. Dont waste too much time trying to "decide" between a language. I just plunged into python (sorry all RoR fans out there, nothing personal)...

django is a great framework for beginners.. start with sqlite for a quick db to use with django then get to postgres as soon as you can.

Re: Ask HN: I want to make a webapp. Where do I start?

#37

Post by run4yourlives »

mrtron wrote: post #33
run4yourlives wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's he re-vamping and why? Look and feel? No need to switch from PHP. Performance? A framework might help, but it might not. Maintenance time? Could be looking ground up here. Again, if this is a redesign for the sake of redesigning, it doesn't really matter what you use. If there is a specific goal though, changing frameworks/languages should only be done if it provides a way to reach the goal.

He is rewriting the site. Why? Because he wants to add a bunch of new features that would take longer to hack into the old system then to rewrite an entire new system. He is open to learning some new things, hence the language switch. He isn't switching for the sake of redesigning, I don't know how you got that impression. Maintenance time is a key factor here - he rarely looks at the code, so PHP-spaghetti (we are t…

Make sure you read this first: http://www.kith.org/journals/jed/2007/10/27/10686.html
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