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Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

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Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#31

Post by maxxxxx »

I think feedback is very important for growth. I listen closely to it.

The problem with 360s in my company is that when you give ideas for improvement you can't know if the manager will make this a negative. This happened to me once: I put a well-intended point of improvement into the review of somebody I really like and respect. The manager made this (I was told later) the main point of the yearly review and it impacted the coworker negatively. Since then I have kept my 360s pretty bland and not really saying anything.

Review systems can/could be extremely valuable but it's hard to implement them in way that they really work. They work probably best where management is genuinely interested in the growth of employees.

Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#32

Post by joshyeager »

10921809211 wrote: post #25
joshyeager wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, ok. I was mostly talking about how an individual can get maximum benefit from feedback. One of the biggest sources of growth for me has been actively engaging and acting on the feedback I receive. For more on that, I strongly recommend Thanks for the Feedback by Sheila Heen. You're right that it's hard to get others to learn from feedback if they don't actively work at it. You can make your feedback easier to und…

Where "grow" means "behave like the manager thinks is beneficial for the company". http://yosefk.com/blog/people-can-read-their-managers-mind.h... Probably better than "Thanks for the Feedback" by Sheila Heen.

Yeah, most feedback is going to come from what the giver feels is important, and a manager will usually prioritize what the company needs. A good manager will also prioritize the employee's own goals, but not every manager (or company) is mature enough to do both at the same time.

But that doesn't mean that you as an individual can't get value from the feedback you receive. You just have to process it intentionally, instead of taking it at face value. That's one of my favorite points in Thanks for the Feedback.

Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#33

Post by joshyeager »

ali_ibrahim wrote: post #10
joshyeager wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, ok. I was mostly talking about how an individual can get maximum benefit from feedback. One of the biggest sources of growth for me has been actively engaging and acting on the feedback I receive. For more on that, I strongly recommend Thanks for the Feedback by Sheila Heen. You're right that it's hard to get others to learn from feedback if they don't actively work at it. You can make your feedback easier to und…

I still think if it incentivizes users in a very straightforward way then this is useful to them. In my reply to drakonka, i mention how it can be used in the career to be a super useful thing not only to them but to the companies where they work or intend to work as well. Do you think it should be done that way?

Yes, that would be very interesting. As a hiring manager, I wouldn't make a decision based solely on that information, but I definitely would use it if it was available.

Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#34

Post by boomlinde »

codeonfire wrote: post #11

In the real world performance review is useless. Would you trust Trump's reviews of Hillary as a cabinet leader or Hillary's reviews of Trump as a businessman? In the real world people just go through the motions of performance reviews and management doesn't care about feedback until they want someone gone. I have seen people completely delusional that they are so far ahead of everyone else and are uniquely qualified…

If you work in an environment where it is somehow beneficial for you to view your colleagues as competitors, maybe that's a problem in itself.

Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#38

Post by ali_ibrahim »

joshyeager wrote: post #33
ali_ibrahim wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still think if it incentivizes users in a very straightforward way then this is useful to them. In my reply to drakonka, i mention how it can be used in the career to be a super useful thing not only to them but to the companies where they work or intend to work as well. Do you think it should be done that way?

Yes, that would be very interesting. As a hiring manager, I wouldn't make a decision based solely on that information, but I definitely would use it if it was available.

Yes exactly! Cannot base the decision entirely on that but atleast the insights can be really interesting. It would be great if you can check out this thread (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12142878) and then give your related feedback. This is how i am trying to tackle this problem.

From the feedback that i have got from this thread, however, feedback is a very personal thing and users who really want to improve themselves don't have a solution right now where they can privately request their coworkers(former or present) for this information and not get potentially penalized for it (if negative) by their existing managers in the performance review meetings.

Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#39

Post by ali_ibrahim »

Thanks for your responses guys! Some excellent answers were given. To sum it all up:

1. Feedback is great, it helps employees develop and improve themselves. 2. The way feedback is obtained in organizations is broken and somehow it acts as a tool by managers to penalize the employees during their performance appraisals meetings.

3. Feedback has to be given in a very constructive manner so that the receiver actually tries to improve it without feeling bad about themselves.

4. Feedback has to be continuous and we cannot except feedback to be delivered only on yearly or bi-annual basis. Real time, contextual feedback is needed.

5. Feedback not only on tech capabilities is needed but also on interpersonal relationships, management/leadership style, professionalism and much more.

6. Most important of all, feedback is a personal thing. It should be requested by the user himself if the idea is to improve themselves and to improve their performance and in no way it should be related to appraisals.

All this feedback is definitely used for improvement and growth and to make yourself a better professional. I had similar thoughts in my mind when i posted this question. Because my latest project that I posted here(https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12142878) and here (https://medium.com/@aliibrahim_36896/story-of-pleasantfish-a...) exactly tries to tackle the discussed problems. This is as we know a not simple problem (and also not easily understandable in the first go) so therefore my solution i believe is far from perfect but to start I have separated feedback from organization level to individual level just for personal growth purposes.

Also, to allow users to grow, i recommend articles/stories to improve those skills.

I would like to thank you all as I have gained valuable feedback information from this thread tech professionals and for growth feedback was a necessary ingredient.

Re: Ask HN: Do we really need performance feedback?

#40

Post by ali_ibrahim »

tomjen3 wrote: post #29
joshyeager wrote: post #2

Yes, feedback is essential for growth. Without it, you can't grow any farther or faster than your own ability to evaluate yourself and decide how to improve. Annual performance reviews aren't a good feedback tool. They are much too slow, and usually also too big and generalized. What you really need is fast specific feedback (within a week, focused on one event, action-focused). With that said, if you want to grow, d…

Honest feedback is important for growth, yes, but be ultra skeptical of peoples motives. Your manager may be downplaying your contributions to avoid having to give you a raise or to discourage you from seeking employment elsewhere.

Indeed a very valid point. Feedback has to be obtained at an individual level and it has to be given just for one purpose of constructive employee growth. I posted my comment summing up all the answers here and how i am trying to tackle these problems in my startup pleasantfish.com
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