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Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

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Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#31

SEO can be expensive and time consuming, and a single update to Google's algorithm can send you back to the drawing board. My advice: take all of the time and money and, instead of SEO, focus on making your product great or creating great site content. If you have a site worth visiting, the quality linking and SEO will eventually take care of itself. People will blog about your site and link to it without you having…

I totally disagree with that advice. A good portion of SEO isn't expensive or time consuming. In fact, none of it should cost money. And a single update to Google's algorithm rarely harms folks who are doing white-hat SEO.

SEO effort is a multiplier. You can have outstanding content and make no SEO efforts and yes, you'll probably do okay. You can have crappy content and be brilliant at SEO and you'll do great, too. The best scenario is to have great content AND great SEO.

Of course, part of SEO IS building something worth linking to (and doing a bit of social engineering to get folks to link to you more than they otherwise would). Check out Mint for an outstanding example of this.

Great content/software and SEO are not mutually exclusive and 95% of the SEO tactics you need can be learned in a weekend and implemented as you go along.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#32

0. The zeroth rule of SEO is get your site listed for a search for your site. If your site is bobsfishingtips.com, make sure if someone searches for Bob's Fishing Tips, you get found. This means simply getting at least one real site to link the name of your site to you, or maybe a couple sites if you have some common word like Yelp. 1. After that, make sure people link to you with proper anchor text for other keyword…

Great summary. I'd add that SEO is not just a ranking exercise-- it's a conversion exercise. On top of all of the factors that you need to consider for ranking, you should consider that the first ~60 characters of you tag and the first ~150 of your meta-description are what drives people to click through to your site. Also, all other things being equal, the first position on SERPs gets ~42% of clicks... So it's a win…

This all seems like good advice too. I think the top SERP gets more than 42% of clicks though... more like 70. SEO is in many ways a winner-take-all sport at this point, and it's gotten more so over the years. Google released some eye-tracking data and people just look at the top 1 and then top 3 results, then they re-search.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#33

SEO can be expensive and time consuming, and a single update to Google's algorithm can send you back to the drawing board. My advice: take all of the time and money and, instead of SEO, focus on making your product great or creating great site content. If you have a site worth visiting, the quality linking and SEO will eventually take care of itself. People will blog about your site and link to it without you having…

I'm not so sure this is true. We had one site up for a few months and eventually realized we had done something silly (WRT SEO) with our internal site/link structure.

So we did a minor fix and within a week Google had indexed twice as many pages as before (& ramped up traffic too).

Sometimes it's the obvious.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#34
post #10

Here's the basics: - Research your keywords, make a list, especially paying attention to which ones are the most popular. The results may surprise you. https://adwords.google.com/select/KeywordToolExternal - Optimize your title tags (different on each page, mention your keywords, first 4 words of the title count the most) - Put your keywords into high-value elements (h1-h4, img alt text, ul's, dl's) - Get links from…

what's wrong with subdomains?

I'm not seeing that Matt is really admitting that there's anything wrong with them. http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/subdomains-and-subdirectories/

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#35
Search engine optimization is about (1) some basic technical steps that most standards-complaint developers understand, and (2) making your website worth caring about so people WANT to link to it. At least, that's the non-sleazy kind of search engine optimization.

The magic spell you're referring to is just that; a magic spell. The reality is that these people make hundreds, if not thousands of these "niche sites", and 1 in 100 is marginally successfully. They do it at such volume and with such an efficient system of rolling out template websites with useless filth the internet doesn't need that they can turn a profit.

But their real profit comes from selling their system, using select stories like the ones you've heard, or generating a month or two of profits and then flipping the website to another owner. Unfortunately, these websites rarely maintain said profit.

The real question you have to ask is whether you would rather make an average of $5 per month off of 200 websites, or $1000 per month off of 1 website.

For a technical person, there's no doubt that the 1 website is the "easier" road, and it ain't easy. But 200 websites making $5/month ain't easy either. The people doing so have an extensive and intricate understanding of internet marketing sleazeball tricks, the same way many technically-oriented hackers here know their craft inside and out (the good and the bad).

Still, there ARE some quick things you can do to optimize your pages and create your own “link neighborhood” when you launch a fresh site. Real success comes from really making something HUMAN BEINGS want to visit... but these things will jump-start you once you have that material.

1. Pick a domain name that matches your primary keyword.

2. Get other important keywords into the secondary page URLs using mod rewrite (or a platform that supports it, like Wordpress).

3. Make sure every page has a unique title and H1 tag that matches your primary keyword objectives for that page.

4. Make sure the homepage links to most, if not all, other pages (at least to start).

5. Make sure every page links back to the homepage and many other secondary pages using appropriate anchor text.

6. Register on every social media site that makes sense for you (using this list). Include a link to the site in your profile. It helps if the username you choose is a primary keyword.

7. Link the social media profiles to each other where applicable. Fill them out as fully as possible.

8. Actually use the social networks. More activity will create more pages of content with more links to the profiles, in turn passing more “juice” to your website.

9. Claim your site using Google Webmaster Tools. Submit your sitemap (preferably one that is automatically updated).

10. Do a Google Search for every one of your top keywords. Figure out how to get a link from any site showing in the top 20 results.

11. Do not under any circumstance pay someone for a link. Do not offer or accept offers to trade links.

12. Avoid linking out to shady websites of any kind.

13. Study the keywords your competitors target (if they use meta-keywords like bozos, you can just lift those from the source).

14. Write a blog, or find some other way to continually add new content. This adds to the content you have indexed, but is also another opportunity for links. Long term strategy right here.

15. Build a Twitter client, wordpress theme, or something else that people will link to and use with persistent links to whatever you decide is in the by line.

Follow these tips and you’ll end up with a few hundred links to your site. That should get you indexed and off to a start, but its no replacement for the real work of being worth caring about.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#36

0. The zeroth rule of SEO is get your site listed for a search for your site. If your site is bobsfishingtips.com, make sure if someone searches for Bob's Fishing Tips, you get found. This means simply getting at least one real site to link the name of your site to you, or maybe a couple sites if you have some common word like Yelp. 1. After that, make sure people link to you with proper anchor text for other keyword…

Great summary. I'd add that SEO is not just a ranking exercise-- it's a conversion exercise. On top of all of the factors that you need to consider for ranking, you should consider that the first ~60 characters of you tag and the first ~150 of your meta-description are what drives people to click through to your site. Also, all other things being equal, the first position on SERPs gets ~42% of clicks... So it's a win…

Excellent point. I was in charge of much of the SEO of a large internet retailer and our organic traffic was stunning. Unfortunately no matter how hard I lobbied to start work on conversion, split testing etc, they insisted I do nothing but drive traffic to our poorly converting sites. When sales started flattening out despite the continuing month over month increase in organic traffic I was let go as a cost saving measure. And while still an Internet Retailer 500 company their position has slipped significantly down the ranks. At the time I left we had top ten positions for hundreds of our most important key words including #1 position for many of our first tier words. When doing SEO remember that traffic is only as good as it converts.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#37
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All good advice. I'd add: 1 Speed matters. Google is on record about this. They want your site to load quickly. This factor is part of the 'caffeine' update that Google is in the process of rolling out http://searchengineland.com/site-speed-googles-next-ranking-... 2 Don't stop with H1s. Think about the structure of your page. Subheaders should be H2, and so on. 3 Use Google Webmaster Tools to submit a sitemap. They'…

You don't need a site index unless you have a strange site. If you have text/HTML and you are linked from other sites, the site map won't matter.

A site map is an excellent way to make sure that it is your content that makes it in to google rather than someone that 'clones' you.

It can give you a few days lead over the cloners and that's sometimes all you need.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#38

Search engine optimization is about (1) some basic technical steps that most standards-complaint developers understand, and (2) making your website worth caring about so people WANT to link to it. At least, that's the non-sleazy kind of search engine optimization. The magic spell you're referring to is just that; a magic spell. The reality is that these people make hundreds, if not thousands of these "niche sites", a…

> 1. Pick a domain name that matches your primary keyword.

What's the last time you actually managed to follow that point of your advice ?

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#39
I am surprised no one has mentioned this yet: http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2010/03/googles-s...

Google recently published an internal SEO audit. The report is more or less a blueprint of what you should follow on an on-site level with your own site and I would have to imagine that was the intent.

Re: Ask HN: "Basic SEO"?

#40

Build Links. Here are my 5 steps to get started from nothing, with 5 free bonus steps. Do one of these per week, in a little over a month you'll have a foundation. Remember SEO is like farming, you reap what sow and it takes a long time to reap the harvest of all the hard work. 1. Leverage your competition, by finding your top five closest competitors and spend your first round of SEO getting links from the top 100 s…

On #3, you can pay someone $6/300 words to get unique content written (and that includes some level of SEO research on the phrases you request). If the quality isn't quite what you'd hoped, use those articles as a starting point and then expand on them, tweak them and reword certain points. Paying more for higher quality pieces is an option too.
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