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Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

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Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope the entire patent system is simply dissolved. Patents are an artificial restriction on free trade that prevents competition and put profits in the pockets of the greedy undeserving.

But don't you believe it encourages innovation ? That's the main argument in favor of patents

I really don't

Innovation seems to come from

- Academics, who would be doing the same thing regardless of patent revenue

- Entrepreneurs (and people working for small companies), who are hurt much more by the existence of the patent system than the potential revenue from it.

- People working for big companies, who would almost always be building the exact same product if the patent system didn't exist, except they wouldn't have to worry about working around competitors patents.

Certainly the patent system makes some people money, but it mostly seems to be

- Lawyers (for obvious reasons)

- Owners of already very large and no longer very innovative big companies, who had the time to build up a war chest of patents.

I don't particularly believe that giving extra money to either of those groups encourages innovation, and I certainly don't believe it encourages innovation enough to make up the harm it does to people attempting to be entrepreneurs, people having to work around patents, and so on.

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One potential exception to this is bio related industries, which are different in that patents are often the primary product a company produces, instead of a byproduct produced by engineering work that happens for other reasons. Without patents you would need to find another way to fund that work, if you want it to happen. I wouldn't call most of that work particularly innovative though, it's mostly just very expensive mind numbing work like "trying a million different possible drugs" and "running huge human trials" and so on.

I would generally prefer that the bio work be funded by a different system, because I don't think the patent system produces good outcomes for society. It creates perverted incentives to always be creating new drugs, instead of finding new ways to use old ones. It creates perverted incentives to not build on each others work. It means that drug companies have the ability to charge substantially more than the cost of production for drugs they produce, meaning people who could be treated cheaply in an optimal system go untreated (note: The marginal cost of treating more people is really small since the expensive part is the R&D that already happened). Moreover it forces drug companies to do that if they want to recoup their R&D costs.

Something like direct government subsidies to companies who discover drugs that people end up using (for medical purposes) seems like a better solution. There are a million variations on that, but I'd claim that basically any variation on that is probably better than patents.

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#283
post #50

As someone who has dealt with this I suggest you figure out a way to avoid the patent. Read through the claims, figure out what combination of features they have patented and then change your product to avoid those features in that combination. You likely can either do something more advanced or something less advanced -- if you have the choice do the more advanced solution as you are then likely pushing your product…

You are not a lawyer, do not give out legal advice. I’d almost hesitate to suggest you should stop giving out advice all together, given your ignorance…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#284
post #103
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds strange. If you have really been sued you may be able to find out on PACER ( https://pacer.uscourts.gov/ )

Yes, my case is on Pacer.

It is also public if you google for it now.

Interesting fact. These lawyers won a case against the guys who are suing you: https://sabety.net/2020/01/patent-troll/

Maybe worth engaging with them?

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#285
post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Patents have their uses. Trade secrets are worse. We should not through out the baby with the bathwater....

Are trade secrets really worse? My (uninformed, anecdotal, unsubstantiated) intuition is that reverse engineering, or even just the knowledge that something is possible, ensures that trade secrets are no barrier to progress. While patents definitely seem like a barrier.

If company is providing a service instead of selling products then reverse engineering is much much harder or not possible at all.

Example: Are you going to reverse self-driving code from a vehicle giving you are ride? Or a server behind an API?

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#287
post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure it's still considered rude.

You're obviously not a woman who has had to deal with potentially threatening people in your love life. Among women ghosting is 100% a legitimate way to refuse a second/third/etc. date. In business, companies routinely ghost candidates they're not interested in because of the hassle and risk in interacting with candidates who are clearly no-hires. You don't owe anyone with whom you do not have a solid established rel…

Rational as it may be, it's still rude.

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#288
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People take enough cheap shots at adtech folks, when they offer their perspective. I assume the patent troll approach would be that they're returning value to their investors, while following the law as it stands.

I hope the entire patent system is simply dissolved. Patents are an artificial restriction on free trade that prevents competition and put profits in the pockets of the greedy undeserving.

"Patents are an artificial restriction on free trade"

So is copyright, without them both the concept of IP dissapears.

Patents at least have to be usefull, and documented publically for future use.

Copyright of code by comparison is an abomination, it does something to your smartphone and data, you have no right to inspect it or change it.

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#289
post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd think it should be a law against racketeering (something like RICO). Some tried to use that against patent trolls, but it didn't work.

We just need a “well duh!” Doctrine on the patent. If you can ask and answer it as an intern interview question (e.g. how to cache a QR code database)

The patents already include that, they are meant to be only given on things that are not standard practice or obvious to any competent proffesional. Just software patents fucked it up

Re: Ask HN: I was hit with a patent troll lawsuit, how do I deal with it?

#290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking forward to the day a patent troll comments on a discussion

Largest "patent troll" in history was brainchild of and founded by former Microsoft CTO. The person who coined the term "patent troll" helped him start the company. He came from Intel. The saddest part of the idea of "trolling" as a "business" is that it has spread into other areas, outside IT. "Patent trolling" is easy to spot when the patents are software patents as so many software patent are low quality. However,…

> The saddest part of the idea of "trolling" as a "business" is that it has spread into other areas, outside IT.

I'd say the business idea was created by the govt. Finding new ways to profit via exploiting the laws will always happen sooner or later if they exist.

Hardware and software are perhaps unusual because the patent office has such a divergent idea of what is and novel and obvious to experts versus reality, presumably because computer technology moves so fast.

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