Others have brought up 2FA. I've been looking for a simple (RSA SecurID FOB style) display device that only provides OTP codes. Does such a thing exist? I'm not even above buying a dozen of those old FOBs if it gets the job done
Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
251–260 of 289 posts
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#252Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have traveled a lot over the past few years, including several times through hostile customs (eg USA). I have never had any of them go through my phone or even ask to see it. And to be quite frank, I don't see what use a border agent or the government would use from my phone that they couldn't get in a different, simpler, less blatant way. I'm not sure what threat model you're fighting against, but it may exist onl…
Same. 50+ countries and I only had to turn my laptop on for the TSA.
It happens. Especially to people on such lists as activists, journalists, etc.
I'm not joking, look it up: https://www.google.com/search?q=phone+unlocked+at+customs
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#253Earlier quoted context omitted.
How is this possible? Are you from an older generation? Do you live so far away from the city?
How is this possible? It's easy. Let's pretend you have a smartphone and a computer. Take the phone, and look at every application that you actually use. Make sure that application can be used on a web browser and you have the credentials stored in a password manager. Transfer your cell number to a VOIP service. Find your carrier and cancel your contract or autopay or whatever. Now shut off the phone, and leave it in…
Then you discover your bank, your credit card, your shopping mall, watsapp, gmail, facebook and grinder, all have blacklisted sms to VOIP numbers and also, they're phasing out SMS support anyway... So you'll need all their own specific apps anyway... And both your neighbourhood burger king or the whole airport in which you just landed, won't let you order food without a phone, an app and a qr-code...
And then you live in Italy where you can't ever buy stuff over 1000€ with cash... And where you need an app to access the nation's many exclusively online services.
No. You can't avoid it. All you can do, with this kind of passive resistance, is delay it for a bit. :/
We (the people) need to push back and be vocal about the stupidity of this trend.
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#254Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't see anyone demanding a planned economy. I see people recognizing reality - JIT is efficient but fragile in the face of disruption. Seems to me the sensible thing to do would be to recognize that for what it is and try to strike the right balance in an uncertain world. Even if your concerns are strictly commercial, a couple points margin in good times is unlikely to balance a year of massively screwed up suppl…
What makes you think the right balance hasn't already been struck? It seems rational to me that a pandemic followed by a chip shortage driven in part by crypto would be extremely unlikely, and if they had two years of extra stock on hand that would almost suggest to me they were too prepared (i.e. wasting money). Like if the zombie apocalypse strikes tomorrow, you probably will be unprepared, not because you're bad a…
> What makes you think the right balance hasn't already been struck?
Because it wasn't in the company I work for, and it wasn't at many of our suppliers, and it looks like similar things happened most everywhere else.
We've made a number of changes, both to how and where we source things, to how much of what we keep in stock, and changed processes to re-evaluate suppliers and overall state-of-the-market more frequently.
I know some of our vendors have as well, both because in some cases we asked them to, and also just from talking to them.
If your firm has achieved planning perfection, congrats. I mean that sincerely. But I don't think a lot of other places have.
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#255I use Google Voice, and the number that I use for PINs I can login to with just a password. That way I can always access text messages even if my phone is gone. You need it when traveling and your shit gets jacked. I haven't tried it but an Android emulator should allow you to use apps without a smartphone.
> I can login to with just a password You're logging in with a Google Account and when the account gets locked it's game over with no chance of appeal. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31070914
Yeah I guess that would suck. Time to find a new VoIP/SMS provider
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#256Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you don't have you banks app, you can still go to the actual bank and tell them to do your transactions.
That's not so easy nowadays. Firstly with covid-19 many banks don't accept walk-ins and have a long waiting list for appointments. Secondly, what if the bank or other service i'm using has no physical offices at all? Or what if they're simply too far away and I'm an octogenarian, perhaps with no driving license? Eh? Am I supposed to take an uber to somewhere 100/200 miles away just because morons are given decision-m…
That was the point of my "argument". I was trying to point out how silly the original comment was.
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#257Earlier quoted context omitted.
> you need to call them up to reset this My bank sent me a super key (some colorful QR code) to setup new 2FA devices, which I need to securely store somewhere.
It's interesting that a super key even exists. Normally the enrolment QR codes are one time use only.
This is incorrect.
A standard TOTP QR code can be used on multiple devices or saved and printed (and stored in a safe or something). There is no expiration date encoded in the QR; it is simply the shared secret for the TOTP app to use and some extra metadata like labels. See https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc6238
It is a good idea to enroll multiple devices as a backup against failure, or to store it somewhere safe.
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#258They're more reliable than any other affordable device capable of filling thr "Your whole life in a box, I've ever seen, at least subjectively.
Nearly no moving parts(The few remaining ones seem to be the #1 failure mode), a general purpose OS that's truly designed for what it does, etc.
On top of that, they have some built in safety features like the ability to remotely disable, wipe, and track them, plus, normal bank transactions can be reversed. I would much rather have a phone-linked account than go back to cash, and people used to carry that all the time.
Plus, for all the horror screen addiction causes, it does make losing your phone less likely, because you notice fast.
And on top of that, we used to (and still do) have MANY single points of failure ranging from debit card to notebook with meeting notes that could get you fired if you lose it to cash to house keys, any individual one of which could, if lost at the wrong time, cause a similar scale of damage to a lost phone, sometimes more.
Now, if you lose your credit card, you use your phone to disable it. If you lose your keys, you use your phone to uber. If you leave your wallet at home, you sign up for Kroger pay while standing in line, using the card number you stored in a notes file for exactly that kind of thing(true story).
It might slightly increase the risk of some pretty big disasters for some people, but for most of us, I think overall it removes a lot of common failure modes from life, so we accept the downsides.
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#259Earlier quoted context omitted.
Before smartphone, if you lose your passport everything goes wrong as well. (and noticing your phone is missing and finding it back is way easier than passport)
The worrying difference for me here is that when I travel, I pull my phone out of my pocket 50 times a day but I only use my passport once or twice a week and can store it safely in between.
Yeah, but if you lose it you won't notice for a week and it has no GPS tracking, nor PIN lock, and it can be harder to replace.
The phone number is scarier than the phone itself, since backup sim cards aren't a thing most people do, and replacement might be slow or impossible till you get back.
Re: Ask HN: Why did smartphones become a single point of failure?
#260But that’s kinda convinient [1]. The problem is, that there’s no real proper fallback/backup-plan. [1] not only it’s convinient, it’s also similar to what all the future predictions regarding technology said. Some small gadget or bracelet connecting over air and doing stuff.
There is a backup plan. For corporate systems, contact the IT department. For banking, call the bank or go to a branch. TOTP-based schemes can be backed up and used on multiple devices. So on and so forth. It just so happens that most of these backup plans are incredibly inconvenient and might take a long time and effort to get through them.
Something like that, ain’t a plan in my eyes. But yeah, what’s exactly what’s wrong with plan. God forbid you have to book appointment and arive somewhere to get it resolved…