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Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

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Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#241

Post by JonoBB »

eagsalazar2 wrote: post #211
kristopolous wrote: post #168

Vanilla php + html5up + sqlite3. Everyone else here is trying to be stylish and fancy. Your customers don't care what language it's in or whether the code is beautiful. No cutting edge incomplete frameworks, convoluted tooling, piles of inaccurate documentation to read, inexplicable cryptic error messages with a bunch of incorrect solutions on stack overflow, or other incompetently over engineered bullshit. Just go a…

In many areas of the US (the entire west coast for example), PHP is dead - plain and simple. Independent of whether it is good or not, selecting dead or obscure technologies for your clients is completely irresponsible and leaves them with a maintenance catastrophe just because you like php. Yes there is a lot of hipster-ism out there in platform choice but there are plenty of mature, fast, and popular options out th…

PHP is not dead - plain and simple. Independent of whether it is good or not, selecting technologies based on your biases for your client is completely irresponsible. There are plenty of mature, fast and popular options out there. PHP is one of them.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#242

Post by JepZ »

kristopolous wrote: post #168

Vanilla php + html5up + sqlite3. Everyone else here is trying to be stylish and fancy. Your customers don't care what language it's in or whether the code is beautiful. No cutting edge incomplete frameworks, convoluted tooling, piles of inaccurate documentation to read, inexplicable cryptic error messages with a bunch of incorrect solutions on stack overflow, or other incompetently over engineered bullshit. Just go a…

Please correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I remember the combination of PHP and sqlite fails fairly quickly when if comes to concurrent users?

Don't get me wrong, I am very fond of sqlite, but to use it efficiently you have to manage the connections to the database and from what I have heard, that doesn't work particularly well with PHP.

This doesn't mean that the above recommendation is wrong (in fact, I used similar approaches in the past), I just thought that it should be mentioned and if someone wants to build something that has a lot of concurrent users by design, he knows which part will be the first bottle neck.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#243

Post by kyriakos »

eagsalazar2 wrote: post #211
kristopolous wrote: post #168

Vanilla php + html5up + sqlite3. Everyone else here is trying to be stylish and fancy. Your customers don't care what language it's in or whether the code is beautiful. No cutting edge incomplete frameworks, convoluted tooling, piles of inaccurate documentation to read, inexplicable cryptic error messages with a bunch of incorrect solutions on stack overflow, or other incompetently over engineered bullshit. Just go a…

In many areas of the US (the entire west coast for example), PHP is dead - plain and simple. Independent of whether it is good or not, selecting dead or obscure technologies for your clients is completely irresponsible and leaves them with a maintenance catastrophe just because you like php. Yes there is a lot of hipster-ism out there in platform choice but there are plenty of mature, fast, and popular options out th…

There are many successful companies and start ups that use PHP. The same way they exist for other languages and platforms.

No start up became a unicorn because of the programming language they used.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#244

Post by megablast »

kristopolous wrote: post #168

Vanilla php + html5up + sqlite3. Everyone else here is trying to be stylish and fancy. Your customers don't care what language it's in or whether the code is beautiful. No cutting edge incomplete frameworks, convoluted tooling, piles of inaccurate documentation to read, inexplicable cryptic error messages with a bunch of incorrect solutions on stack overflow, or other incompetently over engineered bullshit. Just go a…

And plus, it works on cheap shared websites that can cost $10 a year + domain name.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#245

Post by aianus »

naikrovek wrote: post #180
nooyurrsdey wrote: post #63

For some reason people seem to constant doubt Ruby-ists and Rails Devs. I completely get that other languages have huge benefits over Ruby. Golang being compiled or Java running anywhere, etc... And ruby is slow, totally understood. But if youre talking about getting a functioning webapp up and running quickly ... no way anyone is beating a Rails dev in setting one up. The piping and scaffolding are all built in and…

Well, here's one reason: the amount of time saved when standing up a webapp on Rails is absolutely insignificant compared to the life of that webapp in all situations where that webapp is anything serious. Not to say that Rails apps aren't serious! I'm just saying that the time saved in standing up a webapp with Rails vs., say, Java, is miniscule compared to the develooment life of that application, overall. In short…

Assuming we’re talking about a startup, the expected lifetime of your product is ~0 and so is the number of customers. If you’re somehow lucky enough to ever have so many users that you have issues with rails, you will have the money (VC or otherwise) to deal with it.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#247

Post by isuckatcoding »

0xCMP wrote: post #201

The easiest thing to do is Heroku. They've really nailed it down and the +$2/month for their basic instance is easily worth it if you don't want to spend the time getting everything setup. Automation requires infrastructure and infrastructure is cheap only if you know how to set it up. I run ~3 side projects using Heroku to host a Django project with a GraphQL API talking to Heroku Postgres and Netlify the host the R…

Sorry What did you mean by $+2? I see $7 for their hobby instance..?

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#248

Post by jsmeaton »

innomatics wrote: post #78

Django, Docker and AWS ECS and ELB. Absolutely worth the effort to learn how to build a Docker image and put together bash scripts to push the image and update an ECS service. We have a base project which includes nginx and uwsgi set up to simply serve the Django app and static files on port 80. Having an ECS Docker cluster with spare capacity greatly assists getting new projects up and running quickly, especially if…

May I ask how you’re managing secrets with this setup? For example, the secret key or database URL.

Our current setup deploys an env file which is sourced before starting the process. I’m less sure how this translates to a production docket deployment.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#249

Post by hellofunk »

oreganoz wrote: post #153
jb1991 wrote: post #123

Full-stack Clojure with Clojurescript front-end is about the fastest workflow I’ve ever used. The front-end part in particular with Reagent (a Clojurescript React library) is a very quick workflow compared to all front-end alternatives. There are perhaps more valid options for server, but even still, having the same language in both browser and server is very convenient both for reduction in cognitive dissonance and…

Does Clojurescript support stuff like hot code reloading? And does Clojure have any good framework for an actor system implementation? Because I've been interesting to get an excuse and try Clojure out and what you're saying is really interesting.

Clojure has its own very effective strategy for multi-threading, and it is not the actor model. The language is built for concurrency and much careful language design was tailor-made for the challenges on modern threaded applications. Rich Hickey investigated the actor model considerably, and decided on a different model. In the core language, you have the choice of using its normal futures/threads with highly efficient and lock-free data structures, or using core.async, which is a model like Go channels. The latter is particularly popular in the community and generally the recommended approach.

Clojurescript offered the first and still (in my opinion) best option for hot reloading via "figwheel" which nearly all Clojurescript developers use. It automatically updates the UI as you code it.

Clojure, on the server, being a proper lisp with a real REPL, lets you poke and inspect and reload parts of the running program with no recompile cycle. A typical workflow there is to reload individual expressions or functions in the context of the running program to alter behavior as you develop.

Re: Ask HN: What's your favorite way of getting a web app up quickly in 2018?

#250

Post by hellofunk »

oreganoz wrote: post #175
asragab wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does support hot-code reloading, the preeminent build tool for Clojurescript: https://github.com/bhauman/lein-figwheel has that out of the box. As for an actor model implementation, there is pulsar: http://docs.paralleluniverse.co/pulsar/ Which has erlang-like actors, though some might suggest that core.async and its channel implementation provides everything you might need an actor for, YMMV.

Hmm, I guess I better look deeper into Clojure. Finally I get to play with a Lisp. My main interest with actors is that these can be made to support hot code reloading on the server side. They also tend to be easily composable. Also also, they can be optimized by locality (eg. same-node, same-cluster, different-cluster) I'm biased though, having not worked with CSP or other models.

I think you will find that as far as composability and hot code reloading, the combination of proper functional programming with a true REPL make this a powerful combination in Clojure that will at least match what you would get in a language built around actors.
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