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Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

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Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#231

One of my mentors at the first company I worked for in Silicon Valley never said “no” to one of my ideas. He said “okay, we’ll try it out and see what happens.” He was inherently supportive of new ideas and as a junior engineer it felt very refreshing to not have to argue my way into a feature that I felt strongly about. I’ve carried that same mentality throughout my career. My worst colleagues were the exact opposit…

> There really isn’t much to learn from scumbags since it’s obvious you shouldn’t be a scumbag.

You can learn how to recognize them faster, or how to work with them despite their behavior, or practice standing up for yourself, etc.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#232
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are the exception, you know that right? There will always be outliers. What we should care about is what the technique can do for the majority of the people. But since you are an interesting exception, I'm curious of your take actually. Maybe please offer us some more information: - Why do you think you did slow down after the switch to touch typing? - Why did you feel the need to switch to touch typing if the sk…

> You are the exception, you know that right? Sure, but I don't agree that touch typing is "the" technique and that it's impossible that someone else has come up with a better one independently. Touch typing is a good way to type well, but I don't think it's distinct from "typing", it's one way to type. Just like you can play the guitar even if you don't know the technique. > - Why do you think you did slow down afte…

Thank you for your detailed answers, I appreciate them.

> Sure, but I don't agree that touch typing is "the" technique and that it's impossible that someone else has come up with a better one independently. Touch typing is a good way to type well, but I don't think it's distinct from "typing", it's one way to type. Just like you can play the guitar even if you don't know the technique.

I think you have a point here. Touch typing may not be "the" technique. We should always be open to new and better techniques and not embrace touch typing as a dogma, of course. And okay, it's only one way to type, and there are surely other ways to type.

I'm not saying that everybody has to learn touch typing because it was sent by the gods. I'm not even the biggest fan myself. I agree that it has its problems and I know for a fact that there are a lot of people out there with their own techniques who easily outperform touch typists.

So I'm not defending touch typing "at all costs".

I was praising it because I have an educator's perspective here and have the general public in mind, especially when I offer general advice in a forum like this. At the start of this thread I was replying to a person who seemingly didn't know much about touch typing.

While there are reports of other techniques that easily outperform touch typing in terms of wpn, accuracy and comfort; there are other properties of a technique that may or may not be important depending on one's perspective.

Let's call them "teachability" and "time of mastery". Touch typing is a very valuable tool not just because it allows one to perform sufficiently in terms of wpm & accuracy, but also because it is very easy to teach it. One doesn't even need a teacher as it's completely public and straightforward knowledge. There are very clear instructions on how to master it, and the mastery happens in 3-6 months. All very predictable and guaranteed. I don't know of any other technique that is comparable in this regard.

And there are so many people out there who don't know about touch typing or realize how much better it can make their lives. Touch typing is their quickest path to better productivity.

I cannot tell those people that: "There is this established typing technique that you can master in 3 months, but maybe don't learn it, because there are reports that there are people who developed their own better techniques in a couple of years, and there is a possibility that you can end up like them".

Obviously, the expert's and the educator's perspectives are different here, so I don't really think we're in a big disagreement.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#233
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are the exception, you know that right? There will always be outliers. What we should care about is what the technique can do for the majority of the people. But since you are an interesting exception, I'm curious of your take actually. Maybe please offer us some more information: - Why do you think you did slow down after the switch to touch typing? - Why did you feel the need to switch to touch typing if the sk…

This type of obsession with something that completely ignores facts is not healthy. The arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards efficiency. There’s a reason we’re not all learning touch typing and using Dvorak keyboards.

It's funny. Do you realize that your comment has no content? You speak like a politician. You're just attacking without really saying anything. Maybe answer:

- What makes you call this an "obsession"? There's just a remark and an inquiry. Please point out the obsession part, if you can.

- Ignores which facts? You are responsible with providing at least some of them if you want to be a part of the discussion, do you realize that?

- And what is that reason? The will of the universe?

I certainly wasn't saying everybody should learn touch typing and use Dvorak keyboards. Thank you for the straw man as a bonus.

Read my latest relevant answer that should show that I'm not obsessed with touch typing but have a clear reasoning behind my praisal: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27171906

And if you're going to reply, maybe be a bit more respectful and provide a proper argument instead of empty attacks. I won't engage further otherwise.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#234
post #143

I notice that the vast majority of comments here are lessons learned about office dynamics and interpersonal relationships. Which either indicates that soft skills are much more important than tech skills or that HN's mostly technical audience has had more to learn about soft skills than hard skills. To buck the trend, I'm going to add a few "hard skills" lessons I've learned from managers. From the best: "Every if s…

I appreciate this. I think one of the more valuable advice I was given re:conditionals is to make sure the positive path is the non-branching path. Branch your exception, let your expected path fall through. if ( unexpected = true ) branch; do_expected_stuff Caveat: ways to do things age. Maybe this is no longer true or even slightly advantageous, but so far it has served me. I also prefer 20 lines of simple pedestri…

This particular use of an if statement is subset of what's called a "guard clause", and I'm also a major fan of them. Other guards include an early return for edge cases or that would make the more general path more complicated, rather than just exceptions.

https://wiki.c2.com/?GuardClause/

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#235

One exec I served under - whom was both feared and loathed by peers and underlings - had one quality that I quite admired: no matter how busy he was if I needed his input on an urgent issue the moment I sat down in his office I had his undivided attention. He didn't double-task and constantly check his computer, phone or read/sign papers. I had his full attention while I was there. It's an attribute that stuck with m…

This is the key to being a "Good Manager"; it is the correct way to show respect i.e. that you matter.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#236
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood this way of thinking about touch typing as a distinct skill from typing. My experience was that when you're kid and use a computer for the first time, you need to look at the keys, and then over time you look less and eventually you can type without looking at all. I never saw it as a distinct skill that needs it's own name or needs to be taught in school (apparently I'm wrong about this). It's jus…

> I never understood this way of thinking about touch typing as a distinct skill from typing. Touch typing is a special technique. Typing and touch typing being distinct things isn't a "way of thinking", it's a clear fact. It's not open to interpretation. The keyboard is an instrument. Anyone can use it without learning the proper technique, but the technique helps a great deal. That's the whole point. It is greatly…

You're referring to things like home-row touch-typing. My experience matches GP, which is touch-typing, but not home-row.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You are the exception, you know that right? Sure, but I don't agree that touch typing is "the" technique and that it's impossible that someone else has come up with a better one independently. Touch typing is a good way to type well, but I don't think it's distinct from "typing", it's one way to type. Just like you can play the guitar even if you don't know the technique. > - Why do you think you did slow down afte…

I'm the same way, and the reason is simple - I played MUDs as a kid. I can hit > 100 wpm easily if my brain can keep up. Occasionally something will throw me; a weird bit of punctuation, like the shift + number keys, but that's about it. I've tried to learn to touch type, but the drop in speed, and the promise of ending up basically where I am now means I just don't care. The way I move my hands and wrists and such p…

> I played MUDs as a kid.

For me it was the chat in StarCraft, had to get messages out fast enough not to interrupt the action.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#238
Best:

* Be supportive and non-judgemental, not dismissive.

* Really listen, hear the other person out and validate them, even if their concept or idea sounds dumb. Personal goodwill combined with strengths in the domain go a very long way.

* Be willing to share, explain and help others understand things that are new without treating someone like a dummy.

* Be thorough, systematic and organized, and keep working to improve ourselves, our systems, and our efficiency.

* Take the effort to make personal connections, and more importantly, to nurture and grow them.

* The past is the past - though some bad stuff may have gone down, look to the future, to how we can build and grow.

* If things are not working out, make changes, get it working, and don't be afraid to cut my losses and change track.

* Take responsibility for growing myself, I am accountable for my career and well being, invest in myself for the medium-term and for the long-term, keep learning and make sure it's something strategic. Time is always limited and there are a million things where I can waste time. Figure out what gives me the best ROI and invest there. These are the sort of time and energy investments that take time to bear fruit, and when planned and executed strategically they are well worth the effort.

Worst:

* There's a huge laundry list here, and I'd rather not go into the details. Others have covered this.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#239
post #236
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I never understood this way of thinking about touch typing as a distinct skill from typing. Touch typing is a special technique. Typing and touch typing being distinct things isn't a "way of thinking", it's a clear fact. It's not open to interpretation. The keyboard is an instrument. Anyone can use it without learning the proper technique, but the technique helps a great deal. That's the whole point. It is greatly…

You're referring to things like home-row touch-typing. My experience matches GP, which is touch-typing, but not home-row.

The OP was referring to "home-row touch-typing" as simply "touch typing", as nearly everybody does, so I didn't feel the need to clarify. I don't see how pedanticism helps here.

Re: Ask HN: What lessons did you learn from your best or worst colleagues?

#240

One of my mentors at the first company I worked for in Silicon Valley never said “no” to one of my ideas. He said “okay, we’ll try it out and see what happens.” He was inherently supportive of new ideas and as a junior engineer it felt very refreshing to not have to argue my way into a feature that I felt strongly about. I’ve carried that same mentality throughout my career. My worst colleagues were the exact opposit…

>One of my mentors at the first company I worked for in Silicon Valley never said “no” to one of my ideas

This is key to mentorship and building an actual team. Junior Engineers need help in building their Self-Confidence and grow into Leadership positions and this is the way to do it.

Note that asking you to come up with ideas and entertaining them does not automatically mean accepting it.

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