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Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

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Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#221

Post by adrianwaj »

soared wrote: post #209
adrianwaj wrote: post #205

I have a bunch of ideas where artists and performers should crowdfund their own shows. Once they have the funds, the performer hires out a venue and issues their own tickets. Backers of the initial hiring can get preference or free tickets for getting a venue booked in the first place - maybe even a slice of the final door total. I started thinking about this when analyzing the new crowdfunding site, http://trypieces…

Artists want to make art, not sit on the phone coordinating with venues, vendors, promoters, insurance, marketing, etc.

The venues have their calendars and capacities listed in the system. Marketing is direct to an established fan/follower base with known locations. Imagine if Kickstarter had the final destination of the funds, and customers of the products already locked into place before a fund-raise ever took place and thus known during configuration. Would make the entire lifecycle more deterministic.

I was thinking.. how can I raise money for 10 loaves of bread to distribute to the homeless? Well can't the bakeries at least be listed in the system too and shown during configuration?

But back to tickets - people can carry an inexpensive smartcard and use that to get in with readers. They could also print a qr code, or there could be a manual door list with id-checking as well. Blah, should I go on?

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#222

Post by lelandfe »

peteforde wrote: post #109

Many of the other commenters have explained how the ownership structure of Ticketmaster gives them near monopoly control because they also own the radio stations and the venues and the promoters. (I'm using "they" and "own" very liberally in this paragraph.) The simple fact that there's an ownership link between Ticketmaster and the scalper I mean totally legit resale sites is so wildly corrupt that, well, it's textb…

DICE has poured gas on the NYC electronic music ticket scene and I loathe them.

The most bad thing they enable is increasing ticket prices for each ticket sold. It has ratcheted up show prices across New York dramatically.

Complaining about DICE (“all my homies hate DICE”) is a common thing in my friend group.

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#223

Post by llsf »

magicalhippo wrote: post #158
KingFelix wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cure did this, we got tickets a few days before the shore, bought from reseller directly through ticket master but they could only be relisted at face value, got 8th for $75 I think, it was a great show

Here in Norway they passed a law which states you can only resell tickets at face value. I'm sure there are some scalpers still but I can't recall reading about it in the news the way I did before the law.

Maybe that is what we need in US too.

Matt Haney is trying to do something with AB 1720 (Resale Price Cap), and Ticketmaster is supporting it. https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml...

I am not sure why a bill would set some magic and arbitrary percentage other than 0%. This has likely be negotiated with the industry.

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#224

Post by llsf »

KingFelix wrote: post #118
llsf wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree... and not defending Ticketmaster, but regarding scalpers in general, I am not sure why one would blame only the ticketing system. If the artists are willing to say sell tickets for $50.00 and the demand is such that some resell to $400.00 the same seat. Is it the fault of the ticketing system ? Who is the victim ? - The artist who could have make more money (but then they could have price it better) - The fans…

The cure did this, we got tickets a few days before the shore, bought from reseller directly through ticket master but they could only be relisted at face value, got 8th for $75 I think, it was a great show

I think that is the right way to give the enough price control to the artists. So, if The Cure wants to keep the ticket price low, they can.

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#225

Post by llsf »

llsf wrote: post #223
magicalhippo wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here in Norway they passed a law which states you can only resell tickets at face value. I'm sure there are some scalpers still but I can't recall reading about it in the news the way I did before the law.

Maybe that is what we need in US too. Matt Haney is trying to do something with AB 1720 (Resale Price Cap), and Ticketmaster is supporting it. https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml... I am not sure why a bill would set some magic and arbitrary percentage other than 0%. This has likely be negotiated with the industry.

Thinking more on those 10% cap, it would allow scalpers to sell the original ticket to themselves, over and over, to eventually reach the price of the market.

Unless Ticketmaster takes a significant proportional bite at every resell, nothing prevents scalpers to triple the price of the original ticket, but reselling in a loop.

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#227

Post by caycep »

cyberrock wrote: post #187

Japan has multiple ticket vendors (Lawson is dominant but not close to TM), dozens of venues of all sizes, concert tours lasting years (I have tickets for a show in November 2027), ID checks, ticket lotteries, presales for fan clubs, anti-scalping laws, you name it, but the prices can still be astronomical for local price levels. I think the problem is that there isn't five clones of every popular act.

the konbini company also handles tickets?

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#228

Post by protocolture »

rincebrain wrote: post #104
protocolture wrote: post #103

The market wont change until someone discovers a method to sell better than ticketmaster. Yes ticketmaster sucks, but when competition pops up, it isnt like an order of magnitude better than ticketmaster. Its like Cabcharge. The first real thing that ever challenged it was uber. I change here needs to be similar. Maybe a presale marketplace to attract events? Tours could change to follow the money to an extent? Then…

I think the problem isn't that competition needs to be an order of magnitude better, it's that if places have exclusivity agreements, it doesn't matter how much better you are. The comment in [1] also outlines a bunch of reasons it's extremely difficult to break into. [1] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48452308

"Better" in this context includes having a better offer for the organisation of venues, so they will want to break that exclusivity.

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#229

Post by gamblor956 »

peteforde wrote: post #109

Many of the other commenters have explained how the ownership structure of Ticketmaster gives them near monopoly control because they also own the radio stations and the venues and the promoters. (I'm using "they" and "own" very liberally in this paragraph.) The simple fact that there's an ownership link between Ticketmaster and the scalper I mean totally legit resale sites is so wildly corrupt that, well, it's textb…

in reality they are "blast shield for consumer rage" as a service. Their role is to industrialize the conversion of anger into waste heat while leaving the musicians looking like neutral parties.

That isn't discussed much because it's not true. Artists get paid a fixed amount for each performance and only get a share of ticket revenue if the # of tickets sold exceeds a contractual threshold. Artists don't get a portion of the fees; those are entirely TM's revenue regardless of the number of tickets sold.

Ticketmaster gets crap for its business practices because they are crap business practices.

Re: Ask HN: Why hasn't there been a real competitor to Ticketmaster yet?

#230

Post by insane_dreamer »

dboreham wrote: post #201
insane_dreamer wrote: post #114

I don't know much about the details work (I don't buy tickets through TM), but I've wondered why doesn't TM just ban the resale of tickets? If someone buys a ticket from TM for $100 and resells it for $300, that person is pocketing the $200 difference, not TM. So why does TM allow it?

To make money?

but isn't it the resellers who are making money from the resale, not TM?

or can you only resale tickets bought through TM on TM? I thought they were exchanging hands offline the old-fashioned way.

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