What's your own level of experience? I think the answer may differ depending on this. Also to get a barometer on just how dysfunctional the company is versus realistic expectations.
Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
221–230 of 288 posts
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#222Earlier quoted context omitted.
The above holds if you have serious equity stake otherwise it's an opportunity to burn out without much upside.
The upside is to become a person who has done that kind of thing. That gets you paid about 5x of someone who can just operate in an environment that's good to begin with.
I would take serious issue with this postulate. With less effort you could get a much higher paying job at less dysfunctional top tier tech company. You will also develop skill set that is valued by the above mentioned top tier tech companies.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#223Earlier quoted context omitted.
The upside is to become a person who has done that kind of thing. That gets you paid about 5x of someone who can just operate in an environment that's good to begin with.
I would take serious issue with this postulate. With less effort you could get a much higher paying job at less dysfunctional top tier tech company. You will also develop skill set that is valued by the above mentioned top tier tech companies.
I agree with you 80%. Compared to working at a crappy company, working at a top-tier is an obvious winner.
However, becoming a change maker is a different category of employee/pay/skill set.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#224A job does not care about you. Always care for your own health and life interests above all business interests.
You should not quit immediately, and instead job-hunt so you can get an offer while still working. Hiring companies prefer to hire someone who is still working, and you don't want to burn your bridges (even a shitty company's employees are future bridges).
A lot of people in my company were smart and pivoted to working for FAANG from here, and I think they were here less than a year. In retrospect I wish I'd followed them.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#225It's unprofessional to stay there if they don't listen to your expertise.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#226They're not going to wonder if it's professional to lay you off if their finances turn shitty.
If you've got the means to leave and do a job search again, I think you absolutely should.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#227> Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
No, absolutely not. Next question, please.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#228> I'm senior and was hired as such Someone hired you as a senior employee. Senior folks are expected to fix messes like what you describe. Go to the right person and ask for the political capital and support to fix 2 specific things. If you don't get a promise for that support or you don't see that support sustained, leave. If you get that support, fix exactly those 2 things as quickly as possible. Then ask for the s…
If there is a lot of mess, in most cases, the organisation is dysfunctional. It may have histories of some futile attempts by proactive senior engineers to improve the situation in past. They were either ignored or faced resistance, and eventually they gave up and moved.
On the other hand, it is a good chance for a new senior engineer to show their leadership abilities, if an organisation recognises the mess and is serious about dealing with it. You will definitely learn about it in the interview and see the management encouraging relevant activities.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#229Earlier quoted context omitted.
On top of that, if you're burned out, then you aren't acting at the level of a senior engineer. These titles matter, you're being paid for your seniority.
The forces behind burnout don't decrease just by operating as a senior.
My point is that seniority implies a certain level of professionalism. If you're getting burned out you're not at that level.
Re: Ask HN: Is it unprofessional to leave a new job where everything is a mess?
#230Professionalism doesn't even come into it. You're under no obligation whatsoever to even tell them why you're leaving but if you do, you're doing them a favour. If they know what's good for them they'll have exit interviews but I doubt that's a thing they do if they're not willing to hear you out or fix things when you're actively working for them.
Further, anything you say in an exit interview can and will be used against you. So either tread lightly or keep quiet.
That depends on the environment/culture of the company. Anywhere I've been that has done exit interviews has done them in order to improve themselves as a company. Yes, tread lightly if you think they'll use it against you but you can still give feedback at most places without burning any bridges if you do it with some tact.