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Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

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Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#211

Post by koheripbal »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #179

"Lazy" is just another way of saying that you're not doing something somebody else thinks you should be doing. Nobody is lazy at playing video games or eating a favorite food. If you like doing it, you do it. You can't be lazy. You can only be lazy in some kind of context where you or others judge you and find you wanting. So two pieces of advice. First, stop judging so much. Do what you love doing and don't feel the…

> "Lazy" is just another way of saying that you're not doing something somebody else thinks you should be doing.

"Lazy" can also be a way of saying you're not doing something _YOU_ think you should be doing.

I agree that other people calling you "lazy" is a projection of _their_ priorities, but the term is also applicable in you describing _yourself_.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#212

Post by elbear »

There can be multiple reasons for your behavior.

What I think could help you the most is reading about schema therapy[1]. It's a therapeutic method which says we all carry certain lifetraps which we acquired during childhood.

Some lifetraps: - abandoment: you are afraid of being abandoned by a loved one - worthlessness: because of the way your parents treated, you feel that you don't have any value. You can't understand why anyone would love you, for example. - failure: you believe you can't accomplish anything in life

There are a few more.

I found this book very helpful in understanding Schema Therapy and the lifetraps that apply to me: https://www.amazon.com/Reinventing-Your-Life-breakthrough-be...

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schema_therapy

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#213

Post by diegoperini »

SquishyPanda23 wrote: post #195
DanielBMarkham wrote: post #179

"Lazy" is just another way of saying that you're not doing something somebody else thinks you should be doing. Nobody is lazy at playing video games or eating a favorite food. If you like doing it, you do it. You can't be lazy. You can only be lazy in some kind of context where you or others judge you and find you wanting. So two pieces of advice. First, stop judging so much. Do what you love doing and don't feel the…

> stop judging so much IMO this is the best advice here. The root issue seems to be anxiety, self-love, and judgment. if your experience of love as a child was conditioned on performance metrics, then any time you go to solve a problem you have to deal with a whole ocean of emotion and trauma that others don't have to deal with. It will take some work to understand and get past it, and my advice would be not to go it…

This!

When we are physically ill or have an acheing tooth, we seek help from professionals and I bet unless it's a chronic disease, these professionals always have a way of treating it by:

1) Doing a check up,

2) Applying a short term solution (comforting medication, cleaning the infection etc),

3) Giving good advice for long term well-being.

The mind deserves the same level of attention and care. We don't need to wait for a crippling depression to finally act. Depression is the disease of not being able to act afterall.

Living a normal life itself is an enough reason to see a therapist.

I don't believe a god or participate in any religion. But I admit that there was a time when more people went to see their religious community leaders to seek help, even for very basic problems. That was a kind of proto-therapy at its infancy. We lost that with modern civilization and contemporary psychology is still considered a luxury instead of a necessity.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#214

Post by mrtb »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #179

"Lazy" is just another way of saying that you're not doing something somebody else thinks you should be doing. Nobody is lazy at playing video games or eating a favorite food. If you like doing it, you do it. You can't be lazy. You can only be lazy in some kind of context where you or others judge you and find you wanting. So two pieces of advice. First, stop judging so much. Do what you love doing and don't feel the…

> If you like doing it, you do it.

This attitude seems to overlook that there can be a tension between present and future fulfilment. There are things you can do (or avoid doing) now that will make your life a lot less enjoyable later on. Activities that 'make you a better person over time' often require effort, discomfort, or sacrifice of some kind in the present (exercising, studying, therapy, etc...).

I don't think it is a good idea to maximise pleasure in the present - at least not at the expense of future pleasure - but to maximise the total pleasure you get out of your life, which will often mean doing something right now that you don't find intrinsically rewarding.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#215

Post by eru »

kharak wrote: post #182
eru wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are different ways for ADHD to manifest. https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/attention-deficit-hyperactivit... has a list of symptoms in adults. > But everything I've read about ADHD doesn't sound like a me at all. If the symptoms listed there don't match, you probably don't have a ADHD, I guess.

Went through the list. I'd say at least 50% matches me completely, but some items are situational or are not even close. - Keeping still? As a kid, I had always a problem keeping my leg still. - Excessive talking? Nope, I was the quite kid. Also never interrupted anyone and still don't. - Acting without thinking? The polar opposite. I didn't act because of all the thinking. That problem remains to this very day. - No…

Not everyone has all the symptoms. For example, I don't really display hyperactivity nor mood swings, nor do I have trouble dealing with most kinds of stress.

> - Short attention span? Well, depends on the situation. In gaming, I can stay focused all day long. I can read a book for hours. No problem staying focused doing physical activities (sport). Staying focused on coding is really difficult and I constantly zone out.

Sounds like the flip side: hyperfocus. See eg https://www.healthline.com/health/adhd/adhd-symptoms-hyperfo... Direct quote:

> Hyperfocus is the experience of deep and intense concentration in some people with ADHD. ADHD is not necessarily a deficit of attention, but rather a problem with regulating one’s attention span to desired tasks. So, while mundane tasks may be difficult to focus on, others may be completely absorbing. An individual with ADHD who may not be able to complete homework assignments or work projects may instead be able to focus for hours on video games, sports, or reading.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#216

Post by surroundingbox »

Perhaps your mental laziness is an unconcious way in which your mind is telling you that you are not in the right track. Since you grew up in a high pressure it seems that now you need an opportunity to live, for some time, under low pressure conditions in order to obtain a new vision about what to do in the future.

Edited: googling I found someone recommended the book the slight edge, and a review is here that contains the main ideas: https://www.amazon.es/Slight-Edge-Jeff-Olson/dp/1626340463#c..., look for Daisy's review.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#217

Post by eru »

lovehashbrowns wrote: post #150
eru wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got diagnosed with ADHD as an adult. I also had sleep issues, but never bad enough to seek help for them. Fortunately, the ADHD meds fixed the sleep issues, too. Have you tried taking some L-Tryptophan in the evening? For some people it works wonders for sleep and mood. L-Tryptophan is an essential amino acid that you can buy over-the-counter. Your body needs it to make melatonin and serotonin amongst other things.

My sleeping issues were never bad enough either until my team started having daily 9AM meetings. Ugh I haven't tried L-Tryptophan! But I'll give it a go. My medication hasn't really started taking effect yet but hopefully I don't have to take sleeping medication once it does. Thanks for the suggestion. :) Hopefully that helps also.

L-Tryptophan is a pre-cursor to melatonin. See eg https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-th...

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#218

Post by eru »

dlivingston wrote: post #144
eru wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's an easy experiment OP can do: see if nicotine patches help. Nicotine is a safe stimulant that available over the counter; and works really well against ADHD and can help normal people too. Arguably much better than caffeine for the vast majority of people. See https://www.gwern.net/Nicotine for details. One thing to keep in mind: stay away from smoking. That's vile and addictive.

As someone who just quit nicotine (e-cigs/NRT/tobacco-free “dip”) after nearly a decade, stay away from it at all costs. Nicotine is a wonderful brain stimulant (nootropic), but it’s far too easy to become and stay addicted.

Interesting. I only ever tried the patches on and off, and never had any problem stopping. The research that Gwern collected at https://www.gwern.net/Nicotine seems similar.

I never smoked or tried e-cigarettes, though. Smoking is awfully addictive.

I tried half a nicotine gum once. But the stimulant hit was too much at once and made me nauseous for about half an hour. (Similar to eg the effects of way too much espresso, but with much shorter duration.)

Did you ever smoke burnt tobacco?

What was the process of quitting e-cigarettes (and the others you mention) like?

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#219

Post by imtringued »

kevmo314 wrote: post #27
biswaroop wrote: post #11

This could be because you were told you're a smart kid. Kids who are praised for intelligence over effort have been shown in some studies to pick easier problems and give up quickly if a problem is too hard. Check out Carol Dweck's research. Here's an early article: [ https://www.nytimes.com/1998/07/14/science/praise-children-f... ]. Note that there are some criticisms of her work, and like many other studies in psyc…

Oof, I feel that. Any ideas towards improving focus on more difficult efforts? I end up with a lot of unfinished tasks and it's been notably counterproductive.

The problem with hard problems is that its easy to give up. However, just because you gave up doesn't mean you didn't learn anything. Especially beginners write a lot of crap code and it's actually better if that code never makes it to production but when its time for their second or third project their previous experience becomes very valuable.

Re: Ask HN: How do I overcome mental laziness?

#220

Post by eru »

apostacy wrote: post #142
eru wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was diagnosed with ADHD a few years ago when I was 30. I tried a few medications. When I as on Vyvanse, I noticed similar personality changes as what you described. Most notably, my sense of humour suffered. (And before on dexamphetamine, I was really grumpy when it wore off. So I did get into fights.) Things got better after I changed to methylphenidate. For me, it's milder in the side effects. Modafinil and nicot…

Yes, I have had good experiences with methylphenidate (Ritalin) as well. One thing I noticed is that on adderall I stopped yawning completely. On Ritalin, my body is actually able to signal to me when I'm tired, hungry, etc. The problem is that I had to take ever larger amounts of caffeine to compensate. I just know that I don't want to be taking adderall when I'm 40.

Yes. I had similar reaction: I was very relieved that I could take a nap on Ritalin. That never worked on dexamphetamine.

Though I also heard from some other people for whom Ritalin has intolerable side effects, but Adderall works.

Honestly for me, if methylphenidate wasn't available, I'd go with nicotine patches and perhaps modafinil instead of dexamphetamine.

Thanks to billions of smokers we a have pretty good idea of the long term effects of nicotine. Eg we know that it protects against parkinsons. (And there are some indications that Parkinsons and ADHD are linked.)

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