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Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

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211–220 of 220 posts

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#211

First of all you should take pride in what you have done already. You've gone way beyond what most of your fellow country men will ever do. While I understand, you're doing the wrong thing by focusing on this single individual. Since this guy is someone you have gotten to know, you have an emotional tie that is making you blind to the cold hard truth. This happens to someone everyday. - Parents have a falling out wit…

Yeah, if our system puts innocent people away they should reimburse them for that severe fuck up. Maybe focus on changing that law, for the big picture.

And changing the law was what I was hinting at

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#212

First of all you should take pride in what you have done already. You've gone way beyond what most of your fellow country men will ever do. While I understand, you're doing the wrong thing by focusing on this single individual. Since this guy is someone you have gotten to know, you have an emotional tie that is making you blind to the cold hard truth. This happens to someone everyday. - Parents have a falling out wit…

Are you seriously saying this lawyer is doing the wrong thing? Why don't you go and exercise your judgement what you think is right in your own life instead? Shame seems to be a lost value.

He did the right thing in getting in getting this guy out of jail.

On quite frankly thats more than enough to feel proud.

His question is "what now?" from the point of view that the guy he helped is out on the street.

I get it, I'm just saying that at some point you need to start looking at the bigger picture.

And yes, I do always look at the bigger picture when I choose to contribute.

I'm a little pissy since looking beyond the inch in front of your nose seem to be a lost arts.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#213
post #178

It's also responsible for the destruction of Iraq and the emergence of ISIS. Are you really proud that your personal success rides on the back of so many innocent lives being lost?

Personal attacks are not allowed on Hacker News. Between this and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12014468, you've crossed the line badly, twice in one thread, so we've banned this account.

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12013800 and marked it off-topic.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't speak to police unless you can handle your business.

This is dangerous advice. Chances are you cannot "handle your business" to such an extent that you can out-maneuver professionals with years of training whose sole aim is to put you behind bars. Don't talk to police.

the fact that people are being discouraged to handle their affairs is alarming.

your right to remain silent will still be used against you. And most people are too ignorant to realize when they've given up that right (as soon as you open your mouth and speech comes out).

if you're truly incapable of learning how to handle your affairs, do not talk to police.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is dangerous advice. Chances are you cannot "handle your business" to such an extent that you can out-maneuver professionals with years of training whose sole aim is to put you behind bars. Don't talk to police.

What's the best way to social engineer in this situation. "I'm not talking to you" without agitating them? Just say, "wait until I get my lawyer and we'll talk?" What do you guys think?

if you choose to invoke the right to remain silent, don't say anything until you're in the interrogation room, then demand your lawyer, and go back to being silent until they let you call him, or he arrives.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the best way to social engineer in this situation. "I'm not talking to you" without agitating them? Just say, "wait until I get my lawyer and we'll talk?" What do you guys think?

if you choose to invoke the right to remain silent, don't say anything until you're in the interrogation room, then demand your lawyer, and go back to being silent until they let you call him, or he arrives.

I see your point, but I want to also social engineer the situation so the officers feel like I want to help them and I am on their side, while also giving no information.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A while back I made an easy-to-remember Bitly link for a YouTube video of a law school lecture featuring a law professor and his criminal investigator (police-side) friend that totally backs up your point. Enjoy! https://bit.ly/dont_talk_to_police

Thanks I enjoyed watching that. I wonder how applicable it is in the UK. You have a right to remain silent, but I believe your silence may be used against you under certain circumstances.

Remaining silent can certainly make you appear as though you have something to hide, but at least you're not saying anything that can be used against you. By talking, everything you say is a potential trap, especially if unrelated statements get weaved together out of context. Even if you are telling nothing but the truth, once you've given the same story over and over again over a period of hours of interrogation, most people are bound to let fatigue and frustration result in misspeaking at least once. You say something differently about the situation once, and suddenly everything you've said must certainly be a web of lies, right?

Interrogators - at least in the US - are notorious for overstepping what any person would consider appropriate. Repeatedly hounding someone until they start to admit committing a crime just to get the interrogation to stop, is despicable.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you choose to invoke the right to remain silent, don't say anything until you're in the interrogation room, then demand your lawyer, and go back to being silent until they let you call him, or he arrives.

I see your point, but I want to also social engineer the situation so the officers feel like I want to help them and I am on their side, while also giving no information.

this might be a misunderstanding on the purpose of the Police. If you are being interrogated, they are trying to put you in jail until enough reason is given to not. They are allowed to outright lie to make this happen, so long as you divulge something to them.

This is one of the inherent problems in the "right to remain silent". you are correct in identifying that silence (especially in contracts) is an acceptance in dishonor. Furthermore, by going silent, you are instead accepting a limited subset of rights, in lieu your inherent rights guaranteed by your constitution (in North America anyway), which includes waiving your rights guaranteed by the 4th amendment and 5th amendment.

by saying "yes" to the question "do you understand these rights and they have been read to you", you have given up your right to remain silent, which means you've now waived your original rights, as well as the new rights they read you.

Knowing your rights usually leads to a harder/harsher grilling by the police, as they attempt to test you on them. Not knowing your rights leads to an attempt to railroad you through the system.

The safest path has been "Duress" as implied by Uniform Commercial Code Article 1 Section 308. Inform the police in every encounter (i.e. every time they enter or leave the room) that you are acting under duress, and you intend to cooperate fully. Answer all their questions without hesitation, maybe adding a "please don't hurt me" to the end. If you're given anything to sign, your name now becomes "Without Prejudice" or "Under Duress", so sign it that way. Print that name underneath as well. Once released from police custody, you have 72 hours to inform them that your signature was given under duress, and that you're revoking those agreements/documents signed.

Re: Ask HN: Just got an innocent man out of prison. What now?

#220
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends. If he has a family who is now estranged, or trouble getting a job, a PR campaign may be beneficial. It's one thing to get acquitted in court, another thing to get others to believe you are innocent.

I don't think you know what you are talking about. If no one wants to hire a felon to do some kind of entry level job, how about a felon being followed around by the paparazzi (or otherwise very much in the public eye)? Does that sound better to an employer? I seriously doubt it.

Because paparazzi and other journalist have such a long attention span concerning "human interest" stories about ordinary persons.
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