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Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

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Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#211

Post by chrshawkes »

Amezarak wrote: post #166
dizzystar wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In retail, you don't get free food / liquid. You have to stand on your feet all day. Customers are allowed to scream at you and you have to figure out how to make them happy. Bosses are more than happy to fire you because, let's be honest, there are 1,000 others that can do your job. No guarantees of a 40 hour work-week. No paid holidays, no benefits. Raises are like 25c, and that is only if the boss really likes you…

> In retail, you don't get free food / liquid. Water is free, most likely. I've never had free food programming, beyond nutra-grain bars, once. > Customers are allowed to scream at you and you have to figure out how to make them happy. Toxic clients exist in the programming world, too. And as a low-level peon, you have a lot more leeway in telling an abusive customer to get out than you do a multimillion dollar clien…

Try crawling around in asbestos filled attics or rat infested crawl spaces for 12 bucks an hour.

Programming is much easier than so many professions I've had in the past it's absolutely unbelievable.

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#212

Post by kcole16 »

J-dawg wrote: post #132
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you're rich to start with then you'll still end up making either your investors or your landlord rich. Do it right and you get rich too. But then you're often still perpetuating the system by then employing people who work making you rich. Start a cooperative, forget about being rich and seek the fulfillment of all its members.

I've often thought about the possibility of designing a company specifically to maximise the wealth of its employees. Choose a location with a low cost of living, give equity to all employees, maybe provide accommodation / food as part of the benefits package. I'm not sure if I'm describing a cooperative, I just know that most normal companies do the exact opposite of this: they force you to live in a high cost area…

That's basically the point of most law and financial firms (at least when they start out). Until it went public (and still to a large degree), the whole point of Goldman Sachs was to make its' employees rich.

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#213

Post by turnip1979 »

awjr wrote: post #198
herval wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any advice for freelancers looking for interesting clients? I'm mostly able to find clients that either 1) want full-time employees or 2) are working on 'me-too' CRUDs (sometimes both).

I would suggest looking in the mirror ;) Let's be honest. Freelancers are not there to find "interesting clients". They are a temporary resource that enables a client to get a job done they under-resourced. You have a choice as a freelancer 1) Become money focused. Earn as much as you can for as long as you can. 2) Become idea focused. Earn as much as you can until you have enough to bootstrap the idea. Rinse and rep…

Dumb question .. how does one go about getting started as a freelancer? Are there agencies or some other mechanism to get you started? Specifically, interested in how to get started in North America.

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#215

Post by sumedh »

krisdol wrote: post #203
sumedh wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure what you mean by the high flying CEO, I am talking more from the founder's side who puts his money and time on the line. Take Musk as an example, he invested most of his money in Tesla and Space X and both the companies came close to bankruptcy. Those companies and many others will not work as a cooperative.

Why not?

Because most people who will be working in the cooperative are sane and will bail out if things get tough. You need a crazy founder to take enormous risks.

Just look around you, most of the tech titans are founders who took risk, can you give examples of tech cooperatives which are equally famous?

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#216

Post by krisdol »

I like programming but I'm tired of the hours, of being salaried, and of employers that could lay their filthy hands on everything I make outside of work. I hate "unlimited vacation" but it's nearly impossible to avoid. I like how my small company job is much more intellectually stimulating than my old big company one, but the work never ends and I should be making a lot more in this city.

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#217

Post by gizi »

herval wrote: post #192
lhnz wrote: post #182

I enjoy programming but 'working as a programmer' is infuriating. There are so many interesting product ideas yet 'me-too' CRUD app recreations of previously successful incumbents products are highly desired. This is particularly true in the startup ecosystems where kids talk about 'interesting' problems and finding 'purpose' and yet are blindly following the mantras and motivational speeches of trite capitalists. I…

Do you have any advice for freelancers looking for interesting clients? I'm mostly able to find clients that either 1) want full-time employees or 2) are working on 'me-too' CRUDs (sometimes both).

Pick a niche (with good characteristics) and make sure to be good at things in that niche. From there on, the client or employer will obviously pay you in the way that you want (freelance or employee). The work will also be maximally interesting. I personally get a fantastic rate doing pretty much what I like from my home office.

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#218

Post by hartator »

krisdol wrote: post #216

I like programming but I'm tired of the hours, of being salaried, and of employers that could lay their filthy hands on everything I make outside of work. I hate "unlimited vacation" but it's nearly impossible to avoid. I like how my small company job is much more intellectually stimulating than my old big company one, but the work never ends and I should be making a lot more in this city.

Which city? and why you don't like unlimited vacation? I personaly don't like it because it's a bit hypocritical.

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#219

Post by coderKen »

When I first started out as a self-thought programer and worked for the first company where I really enjoyed my work, the second was horrible, third was cool at first until it began to suck. I am now usually assigned tasks like changing the margin of buttons and other annoying stuff, I don't feel my skills are improving and am not gaining any knowledge. Really horrible

Re: Ask HN: How happy are you working as a programmer?

#220

Post by gizi »

laxatives wrote: post #20

6/10. I'm less than 3 years into my career, but I think I've worked for some of the best companies with great pay, benefits, environments, etc, including a tech giant and two startups. End of the day though, work is boring. Its always work. Your time and effort is going towards making someone else rich and their priorities are more important than your own. The only things I really look forward to are vacations and ev…

> but 99.9% of developers will never make half of what a specialized MD or successful lawyer or someone in finance might make.

It is exactly the other way around. Mark Zuckerberg is a PHP programmer, not an MD or a lawyer. Same for Bill Gates, Sergey Brin, Larry Page, and another host of lesser known billionaires and millionaires. In other words, an MD or a lawyer could impossible make what a successful programmer might make.

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