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Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

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Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#21
post #11

The Portland startup where I work just hired 3 jr. devs. Our goal was 2 seniors and 2 juniors but we didn't get any viable senior candidates. Most candidates were eliminated at the code challenge stage. So that'd be my tip: if you have to complete a code challenge, make sure it's the best code you've ever written. Even if it's a trivial task, things like full test coverage and demonstrating that you know some OOP bes…

How old were these two?

Early/mid 20's.

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#22
post #18

We're a 5 person team at Ayalo ( http://ayalo.co ) with one junior dev; we've had trouble making it work so I'll share some reasons why: - Lack of confidence in his deliverables. The worst is being told its done because it works on local and for small data sets (he's in charge of internal analytics) and then when we try it on production with a months worth of data it crashes. - Having to constantly remind him of the…

If I may so, you've identified this, but a 5 person team is way too small to have a junior dev unless they really know what they are doing. You're really doing a disservice to him because you're expecting way more than he can deliver and you don't have the resources to help him develop his skills. I've seen this situation before and it's frustrating for all parties. In regards to the OP, he should target larger compa…

True. He's grown tremendously while he's been with us and its really not like we're wasting each others time. We constantly ask him to tell us when we're expecting too much and to set his pace / workload. Measured stress outside of your comfort zone is one of the best ways to learn IMO and I do a lot of work with him personally to get him up to speed.

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#23
post #17

We're a 5 person team at Ayalo ( http://ayalo.co ) with one junior dev; we've had trouble making it work so I'll share some reasons why: - Lack of confidence in his deliverables. The worst is being told its done because it works on local and for small data sets (he's in charge of internal analytics) and then when we try it on production with a months worth of data it crashes. - Having to constantly remind him of the…

I feel like including the company name and then proceeding to trash your employee was a poor choice.

Noted, I was worried it would come off like that, my mistake. We're completely transparent with him and he appreciates the clarity into where he actually stands in terms of skill and what needs to be improved. To be clear, though, I meant those points to be more general; framing it around him as the example was the poor choice. I've worked with other devs with a similar level of experience and those are just things I see all the time

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#24

I interviewed a few candidates from NYC-based developer bootcamps and the experience scared me away from even trying to interview any more. The people I interviewed (admittedly only three, but the ones who I thought had the strongest resumes out of their cohorts), were unable to complete even basic real-world programming tasks during the interviews. I would literally sit them down, show them my code base, and ask the…

Great advice. I totally get your concern. That sounds like a horrible experience. As for me, each day I work on a personal rails project that I'm really excited about, and I think that polishing this up will help my case.

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#25

Stop calling yourself a Jr. developer. Instead just send in your resume to places that are looking for Rails developers and include anything you've built so far. That said, if you get an interview I'm not saying to misrepresent yourself. But you're focusing on your inexperience right now. Your resume should focus on what you've accomplished, not on what you haven't.

Yes, you are right. Good point here.

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#26
post #11

The Portland startup where I work just hired 3 jr. devs. Our goal was 2 seniors and 2 juniors but we didn't get any viable senior candidates. Most candidates were eliminated at the code challenge stage. So that'd be my tip: if you have to complete a code challenge, make sure it's the best code you've ever written. Even if it's a trivial task, things like full test coverage and demonstrating that you know some OOP bes…

It's great to hear that you've assembled a strong team that includes jrs. Thanks for the tips regarding the coding challenge / code quality!

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#27

You make it unclear what your skills are. Being a bootcamp, I assume you've got RoR or Node.js as your stack? You also don't specify where you are applying. Startups or corporates? I've also never heard of any major tech companies in OR, so perhaps you may need to consider relocating. If I was in your position, I would go for some company like Oracle/RackSpace/RedHat. Do the ugly grunt work for a year or so and gain…

Thanks for the tips. My stack is RoR.

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#28
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like including the company name and then proceeding to trash your employee was a poor choice.

Noted, I was worried it would come off like that, my mistake. We're completely transparent with him and he appreciates the clarity into where he actually stands in terms of skill and what needs to be improved. To be clear, though, I meant those points to be more general; framing it around him as the example was the poor choice. I've worked with other devs with a similar level of experience and those are just things I…

i think it is nice that your company shows the clarity for these points

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#29

I interviewed a few candidates from NYC-based developer bootcamps and the experience scared me away from even trying to interview any more. The people I interviewed (admittedly only three, but the ones who I thought had the strongest resumes out of their cohorts), were unable to complete even basic real-world programming tasks during the interviews. I would literally sit them down, show them my code base, and ask the…

If you don't mind me asking, what kind of programming tasks were they asked to solve?

Re: Ask HN: Why Will No One Hire Jr. Devs?

#30
In my experience, it's all about experience. Experience teaches you to come right out and ask questions, and not kill time when many of your coworkers most likely know or can intuit the answer.

I'm all about hiring new devs and giving them a chance, but if I meet someone who strikes me as somewhat shy about speaking up its definitely a red flag.

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