Maybe Bhutan.
It is not possible to censor what does not exist, right?
Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
21–30 of 38 posts
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#22Side note: I don't consider DMCA censorship - most of the time the content is available elsewhere, it's just that someone's nicked a copy from the original author (or whoever owns the rights). If I send a takedown notice to someone who's ripped off an article from my blog, people can still read the article on my blog.
> most of the time the content is available elsewhere,
As is often the case with censorship, what happens "most of the time" is not the concern - it's the rest.
The DMCA isn't exclusively a tool of censorship, but no effective tool of censorship is. For it to survive as an effective tool, it has to provide some value in other ways.
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#23I think that here in Uruguay, we don't have any kind of internet censorship, but we have a monopolic ISP owned by the state, so... At any moment they could turn on the censorship switch and there is almost nothing you could do about it.
I feel like this is the general situation on countries where you "don't" have internet censorsihip, you don't, today.
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#24Side note: I don't consider DMCA censorship - most of the time the content is available elsewhere, it's just that someone's nicked a copy from the original author (or whoever owns the rights). If I send a takedown notice to someone who's ripped off an article from my blog, people can still read the article on my blog.
> most of the time the content is available elsewhere, As is often the case with censorship, what happens "most of the time" is not the concern - it's the rest. The DMCA isn't exclusively a tool of censorship, but no effective tool of censorship is. For it to survive as an effective tool, it has to provide some value in other ways.
> but no effective tool of censorship is. For it to survive as an effective tool, it has to provide some value in other ways.
There are laws and tools built exclusively to censor web content all around the world. That's what OP is referring to as "hard, plain sight censorship." How are tools & laws like the ones used by N. Korea, Iran, and a variety of other autocratic regimes[1] not "effective tools"? What value does something like China's "Great Firewall"[2] provide other than censorship?
Seems to be a big difference between those and the DMCA.
[1] http://www.freedomhouse.org/report/special-reports/what-next...
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#25There are two ways to think of "web censorship":
The first is that web censorship (as opposed to just plain old regular censorship) requires filtering or interfering with the end-to-end principle. In this case, the U.S isn't really censored (although we had a close call with SOPA / PIPA). The DMCA and COPPA don't affect the end-to-end principle or block content -- they only threaten penalties on various people on the edges of the network.
The second way to think about this is to say that threatening penalties on people for what they say IS Internet Censorship. The question now isn't about "web censorship" per se, but really about whether said country has any restrictions on speech that can be applied to speech online. And if you take a very strict view of free speech rights, I'm pretty dubious you'll find any country that fits the bill (except perhaps some tiny nation with almost no laws to begin with).
Varying levels of "speech" you'd need to permit to be completely "censorship" free:
* Spammy advertisements
* Infringement of any and all IP rights
* Hate speech
* Threats
* Cyberbullying and other intentional inflictions of emotional distress
* Publication of private data
* (Re)-distribution of child porn
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#26None of the filtering in the UK is legally mandated, and only the major ISPs implement it. Smaller ISPs still offer a completely unfiltered service.
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#27Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#28There are two ways to think of "web censorship": The first is that web censorship (as opposed to just plain old regular censorship) requires filtering or interfering with the end-to-end principle. In this case, the U.S isn't really censored (although we had a close call with SOPA / PIPA). The DMCA and COPPA don't affect the end-to-end principle or block content -- they only threaten penalties on various people on the…
All of the things you mention can be illegal without imposing pre-publication censorship as has been the case with printed material for centuries.
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#29I'm pretty sure there is no censorship in Croatia. Not because of the general philosophy, but simply because I am convinced everyone who works in the government's tech department still thinks FORTRAN is the latest shit in computer science.
The amount of expertise in this country is shamefully low[1].
[1]: Citation needed, but my experience with "technical high ups" would indicate so.
Re: Ask HN: is there still a country without web censorship?
#30Poland censors nothing. So far. There have been efforts to introduce censorship, so far effectively countered.
No event so far, but the law is in place, meaning there is no clear definition if someone publishes on the internet is he/she a journalist. Some may use bullets that you offend head of the state, president or "blasphemy". Better off in a country which doesn't have any tools at all. Over the years there was this notion that US is a role model of democracy and freedom which is a joke especially in a context of recent n…
The question was clearly about censorship. There is nothing of the kind. You can access anything you want and publish anything you want. Certain things you publish might offend people and potentially get you in trouble, but the government doesn't censor the internet.
That said, it is not a battle that is completely over.