To keep you poor as they can manage so you are reliant on them.
Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
21–30 of 96 posts
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#22There’s a whole world of unintuitive reasons for this kind of thing. Non-exhaustive list: - Freelancers are OpEx, FTEs are CapEx. They are usually separate budgets so departments split. - They want to maintain good relationships with the freelance companies in case they need to spin up staffing quickly with top talent in the future. - They don’t have to pay some benefits and taxes on freelancers. - Freelancers and co…
That last is especially important.. it is option value. Same reason a one month lease costs more than a one year lease.
When times get tough they shouldnt hire freelancers in the first place... If they have ongoing hires they pay 3 times as much on a freelancer as they do on an employee... this logic doesn't check out at all
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#23There’s a whole world of unintuitive reasons for this kind of thing. Non-exhaustive list: - Freelancers are OpEx, FTEs are CapEx. They are usually separate budgets so departments split. - They want to maintain good relationships with the freelance companies in case they need to spin up staffing quickly with top talent in the future. - They don’t have to pay some benefits and taxes on freelancers. - Freelancers and co…
This is a helpful list, thanks :) Do you happen to have an idea on how to hit companies up and offer myself as a freelancer? It seems there are non-IT departments that I could help out with getting their AI innovation in order.
Ask the freelancers at your company how they got the job. It's probably through some agency, probably more than one, if your company hires a few freelancers.
Then contact those agencies. Don't ask the freelancers at your company to get a direct contact, they probably have clause in their contract that forbids them to poach employees of their customers.
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#24There’s a whole world of unintuitive reasons for this kind of thing. Non-exhaustive list: - Freelancers are OpEx, FTEs are CapEx. They are usually separate budgets so departments split. - They want to maintain good relationships with the freelance companies in case they need to spin up staffing quickly with top talent in the future. - They don’t have to pay some benefits and taxes on freelancers. - Freelancers and co…
This is a helpful list, thanks :) Do you happen to have an idea on how to hit companies up and offer myself as a freelancer? It seems there are non-IT departments that I could help out with getting their AI innovation in order.
> Do you happen to have an idea on how to hit companies up and offer myself as a freelancer?
You can do cold outreach. Identify a contact and send a message.
Leveraging your personal network is more effective if you can. Freelancers who come through references are more trusted.
Note that if you go through a freelancing agency you won’t be getting the hourly amount they bill your company nor anywhere near it. The amount you get could range from around 80% of what they bill down to 20% depending on the arrangement.
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#25If you’re upset, quit and become a freelancer. You’ll figure it out pretty quickly, I suspect. As a general life rule, if it ever seems like somebody else is doing better than you, instead of bitching about it, do what they are doing.
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#26Freelance labor costs go into a different accounting column than full time payroll.
The dipshits who fixate on KPI's and measured results set random, useless objectives for each other and then celebrate with bonuses and steak dinners when the line for XYZ moves in the intended direction. They don't care about the other lines at all.
I once led a team where the staff made $X/hour in OT and freelancers made $X*3 per hour. My team wanted OT badly, so I gladly gave them as much as they wanted.
In a single conversation, my director told me I lead the region in profits, but I need to get my OT costs down if I ever want to be promoted.
In the end, I was wrong, not him.
They were busy doing a bunch of financial engineering bullshit to convince a different group of dipshits to acquire the company, which they eventually did, and all those guys got payouts, while the teams mostly got cuts.
If you run your own business, especially if it's small/medium, focus on the bottom line and make smart calls.
If you're working for someone else, try to figure out what they value most and try to focus on that.
In the OP's case, it looks like a great time to either:
A) Switch to full time freelance to get the full $150/hr while you can
B) Take the blue pill and pretend as if the lies about job security and stability are real
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
That last is especially important.. it is option value. Same reason a one month lease costs more than a one year lease.
When times get tough they shouldnt hire freelancers in the first place... If they have ongoing hires they pay 3 times as much on a freelancer as they do on an employee... this logic doesn't check out at all
You don't hire the freelancers _when_ the time gets tough, you hire them when you're fine. But _if_ you need to downsize, you can cut them easily.
In a country with strong labor laws, you can't do that with FTEs, you're stuck with them unless they make major missteps.
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#28There’s a whole world of unintuitive reasons for this kind of thing. Non-exhaustive list: - Freelancers are OpEx, FTEs are CapEx. They are usually separate budgets so departments split. - They want to maintain good relationships with the freelance companies in case they need to spin up staffing quickly with top talent in the future. - They don’t have to pay some benefits and taxes on freelancers. - Freelancers and co…
> - They don’t have to pay some benefits and taxes on freelancers.
The employer-paid taxes and benefits on full time employees can be very large, depending on the country.
Even in the United States people are surprised to learn that their employers pay taxes for employing them. You pay some taxes on your income and your employer also pays some taxes for employing you!
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#29> I know that as an employee my 30 euro's is actually "more" due to vacation and pension, etc. but it's nowhere near 150 euro's How big is the difference? How much does it cost to fire you?
I have heard this so many times indeed, and as a contractor myself, it is so tiresome. Taxes, pensions, insurance, reservations for sitting without a contract, courses etc etc etc. Those "30 Euro p hour" People actually easily cost around 100 for the company at least, and that is without factoring in sick leave, severance pay etc. Is there still a difference? yes, that is the risk contractors take. I agree that it ca…
> I have also seen one or two contractors effectively doing 80% of all the relevant work in a 15 man team. Major incident? Contractors in the warroom. Coming up with a new architecture? Contractors. etc. etc.
I have also seen the opposite (as one of the contractors): the employees knew their system well, while the contractors were really missing all the intricacies of the architecture. It would take five years to learn, and contractors wouldn't stick for that long.
Re: Ask HN: Why is my F500 employer okay with paying 5x to freelancers?
#30If you’re upset, quit and become a freelancer. You’ll figure it out pretty quickly, I suspect. As a general life rule, if it ever seems like somebody else is doing better than you, instead of bitching about it, do what they are doing.
I fully agree with that statement.
But keep in mind that the grass is always greener on the other side. Freelancing has it's own challenges. Especially in economically uncertain times, freelancers are the first ones who lose their jobs, if the company needs to save money.