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Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

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Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#21

Post by zainhoda »

I think the RTO is somewhat of a temporary condition. The big companies are telling workers to come back into the office and they’re complying because the job market has softened and people don’t want to lose their jobs.

Companies haven’t realized the detriment that RTO is having on their recruitment because most of the big names are doing layoffs rather than hiring.

It’s pretty evident that companies that are posting remote roles get orders of magnitude more applicants.

Once the economy picks up, the RTO companies are going to have to reassess as their applicant pools will be smaller than WFH companies.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#22

Post by JohnFen »

lmarcos wrote: post #16
jstx1 wrote: post #8

> The best I have is that this is some kind of power play but I'm not convinced. Am I missing something? You can consider that not everyone has the same preferences as you. Many people are more productive and happier working from an office and meeting their colleauges in person. Forcing people into limited open space with unassigned seats sounds like terrible execution of return to office but in general RTO doesn't h…

> You can consider that not everyone has the same preferences as you. Many people are more productive and happier working from an office and meeting their colleauges in person. You mean, that to each their own right? I agree, but RTO is the opposite. RTO forces everyone to work from the office. If you prefer to work from the office, go ahead be my guest. I prefer to work from home. It's a win-win, right? No. Just bec…

I find it very interesting that the WFH crowd is advocating for what works for them, and is not demanding that everyone work from home. The RTO crowd, however, is demanding that everyone conform to their own preferences and work from the office.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#24

Post by operatingthetan »

JohnFen wrote: post #22
lmarcos wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can consider that not everyone has the same preferences as you. Many people are more productive and happier working from an office and meeting their colleauges in person. You mean, that to each their own right? I agree, but RTO is the opposite. RTO forces everyone to work from the office. If you prefer to work from the office, go ahead be my guest. I prefer to work from home. It's a win-win, right? No. Just bec…

I find it very interesting that the WFH crowd is advocating for what works for them, and is not demanding that everyone work from home. The RTO crowd, however, is demanding that everyone conform to their own preferences and work from the office.

For one group the desired outcome allows them to exert control over others, and the other group the desired outcome allows them personal agency. The needs of the corporation vs the needs of the individual.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#25

Post by mikhael28 »

Remote works for some people, for most it probably doesn't work. There is a reason why everyone doesn't have six pack abs - the same reason why people are, in general, more 'productive' when they have people in their immediate vicinity to hold them accountable.

Instead of having the possibility of playing videogames at home, while being online on Slack.

It's kinda common sense - humans have a limited amount of willpower they can expend daily, and it generally takes a lot of willpower to not slack off - especially if your job is boring as hell. Dev work isn't very boring, because it's kind of like art - but you better believe a lot of 'remote' work is mind-numbingly boring.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#26

Post by mikhael28 »

mikhael28 wrote: post #25

Remote works for some people, for most it probably doesn't work. There is a reason why everyone doesn't have six pack abs - the same reason why people are, in general, more 'productive' when they have people in their immediate vicinity to hold them accountable. Instead of having the possibility of playing videogames at home, while being online on Slack. It's kinda common sense - humans have a limited amount of willpo…

Also, the reasons mentioned in this thread of execs trying to re-establish previous power hierarchies pre-COVID.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#27

Post by mikhael28 »

mikhael28 wrote: post #26
mikhael28 wrote: post #25

Remote works for some people, for most it probably doesn't work. There is a reason why everyone doesn't have six pack abs - the same reason why people are, in general, more 'productive' when they have people in their immediate vicinity to hold them accountable. Instead of having the possibility of playing videogames at home, while being online on Slack. It's kinda common sense - humans have a limited amount of willpo…

Also, the reasons mentioned in this thread of execs trying to re-establish previous power hierarchies pre-COVID.

I personally believe that people are more productive in person together, but there are some important caveats: a. the commute must be quick and pain free b. you must enjoy the people you work with c. you must have work that is inherently collaborative, or at least partially collaborative. If it's not fully collaborative, you should work remotely part of the time. d. perks, like an office gym, free lunch, are bonuses that the company can give to help you offset the time/expense of commutes. Free parking is a must.

If you don't have these things... the argument for working in person is low. You should either work somewhere else, or work remotely and save $$$ and time.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#28

Post by ipaddr »

mikhael28 wrote: post #25

Remote works for some people, for most it probably doesn't work. There is a reason why everyone doesn't have six pack abs - the same reason why people are, in general, more 'productive' when they have people in their immediate vicinity to hold them accountable. Instead of having the possibility of playing videogames at home, while being online on Slack. It's kinda common sense - humans have a limited amount of willpo…

If I can't trust you to work on your own whether it is in the office or at home you are not someone I want to hire. Babysitting employees is a waste of resources.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#29

Post by ipaddr »

bakioka wrote: post #4

It's about power like the other one just said. Workers are in a weak position unless there is a surplus of demand. Or you know, actually unionize for gods sake.

I've been thinking about unions. I think unions would naturally form over rto and other issues in big tech but the average length of employment is short and they dangle options to keep you waiting for 4 years that the only people left fear their own role and won't cause waves because they have discovered ways to stick around and want to keep that advantage to themselves.

Re: Ask HN: Is remote going away? Why?

#30

Post by masukomi »

because if i can't see you sitting in a chair in the office how can i "know" you're working? You could be slacking off! Why you're probably slacking off on HN right now!

If your butt is in an office chair then obviously you're "working" and not slacking.

[sarcasm]

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