Unless you want a job, there are more lightweight/interesting frameworks than Spring/Boot. e.g. Javalin+JDBI, Quarkus, Micronaut.
Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
21–30 of 69 posts
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#22I highly recommend either Grails, Spring Boot or Micronaut. There are several others, but they lack documentation, has confusing documentation or is over-engineered. Of these 3, Grails is convention over configuration, and the two others configuration over convention. Micronaut is the most performant and use least memory. Grails has GSP templates, while Spring Boot and Micronaut supports several, but I prefer either…
Second the recommendation for Grails. If you want to get started building a JVM based webapp quickly, using a very pleasant to work with environment, Grails is the way to go.
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#23Java web applications I’d describe as “boring technology” if you want typical rest applications with SPA frontend or a full stack server side rendered (SSR) app. By boring I mean it works with little fuss or churn. Depending on your scale/budget they’re a bit more expensive to host due to JVM memory requirements but performance is good. Not a Java issue but a issue if you choose a language other than JavaScript for t…
For web apps, why use two languages if you can get away with only one? unfortunately, is hard to beat JS/TS here.
That “if” part carries a lot of weight. There’s a whole branch of questions around the quality and suitability of tools available - for example, I was surprised when we hired a couple of JS specialists and their Next.JS project left me surprised to see how many areas it was behind Django circa a decade ago when it came to basic things like performance, authentication, internationalization, etc. and that massive tool chain soaked up a good chunk of time on an ongoing basis.
The deeper question is how often you actually benefit from code reuse. There are certainly some areas where you can share things but you also run into a lot of coordination concerns because the environment for JS in a browser is not the same as in Node, which increases the friction of sharing, and a large chunk of the benefits are things like data validation which can also be substantially eased with things like JSON Schema. Simplifying those test matrices and formalizing your boundaries has more value than I tend to assume at first.
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#24Java web applications I’d describe as “boring technology” if you want typical rest applications with SPA frontend or a full stack server side rendered (SSR) app. By boring I mean it works with little fuss or churn. Depending on your scale/budget they’re a bit more expensive to host due to JVM memory requirements but performance is good. Not a Java issue but a issue if you choose a language other than JavaScript for t…
For web apps, why use two languages if you can get away with only one? unfortunately, is hard to beat JS/TS here.
In typical organizations, you always have a grizzled backend developer well-versed in creating REST backends in Java and a frontend developer well-versed in whatever. So you play to their strengths.
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#25[deleted]
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#26Honestly hacker news is the wrong place to ask questions about Java. There is lots of biased opinions with little experience using Java.
I have lots of experience in using Java (Amazon SDE), writing quite a few web services and applications with it, including front end with JSF.
As such I can safely say that anyone that thinks Java is good to use for anything these days, especially with things like Log4Shell, simply doesn't know enough about computer science. Java is a poorly designed language with corporate bullshit throughout, and while it may have been an option in the past given alternatives, is no longer the case.
Python, Rust, C/C++, Golang, and Javascript (and derivatives) cover pretty much every application category in terms of applicability.
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#27By many metrics it's an excellent choice, but I kind of loathe working with it. However, if you don't mind living in IntelliJ it's significantly better. For example, there's a ton of stuff that doesn't exist, except in IDEland like basic formatting support (this blows my mind). You'll also want an IDE to help you refactor since there's a ton of boilerplate cruft and footguns to avoid. Nonetheless, library support for most business use cases is nearly unparalleled, performance is strong if you can deal with GC and there's a million Java developers to hire from.
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#28Honestly hacker news is the wrong place to ask questions about Java. There is lots of biased opinions with little experience using Java.
I have lots of experience in using Java (Amazon SDE), writing quite a few web services and applications with it, including front end with JSF. As such I can safely say that anyone that thinks Java is good to use for anything these days, especially with things like Log4Shell, simply doesn't know enough about computer science. Java is a poorly designed language with corporate bullshit throughout, and while it may have…
Thanks for making the previous poster’s point for them.
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have lots of experience in using Java (Amazon SDE), writing quite a few web services and applications with it, including front end with JSF. As such I can safely say that anyone that thinks Java is good to use for anything these days, especially with things like Log4Shell, simply doesn't know enough about computer science. Java is a poorly designed language with corporate bullshit throughout, and while it may have…
Thanks for making the previous poster’s point for them.
too funny!
Re: Ask HN: Using Java for a web application in 2023
#30Of course you shouldn't ... instead you should look at PHP, or Elixir, or maybe we should move it to SQLite ... hmm, maybe TypeScript is the way to go? What about Terraforming all the things - wait, what was the question? /s
Use what you are comfortable with and get the app out there. Way more important than what stack you are using. Now excuse me while I go and look at all the shiny things on HN.