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Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

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Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#21

Post by fennecfoxen »

mylons wrote: post #15

airbnb has no serious liabilities, in terms of real estate, on their balance sheets. if they can go cockroach mode, and reduce spending (should be easy with discipline and layoffs), they’ll still be a multi billion dollar company in 2021-2022. and i say this thinking they’re ultimately a cancer on society.

Contrast this with WeWork, where people have been raising concerns about its business model (short-term revenues and long-term lease liabilities) from its inception.

WeWork is dead. The main question now is what specific necromancy the venture capitalists will be performing on its corpse.

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#22

Post by ericzawo »

xwdv wrote: post #18
cameronfraser wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, AirBnB is an unsustainable business and I would also like to see it regulated out of existence. It is extremely classist. Only something that middle class or higher can use while reducing housing availability which primarily impacts lower classes.

Housing availability for lower class individuals is not impacted because low class housing generally isn’t rented out on AirBnB.

You haven't done much backpacking have you.

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#23

Post by kstenerud »

ravenstine wrote: post #13
cameronfraser wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, AirBnB is an unsustainable business and I would also like to see it regulated out of existence. It is extremely classist. Only something that middle class or higher can use while reducing housing availability which primarily impacts lower classes.

I don't get that argument. Going by your logic, housing itself is classist because people who aren't at least in the middle class can't afford houses much of the time. And maybe it is, but then what? Are we supposed to abolish classism because some people are less fortunate?

That's right. Only the middle class can afford houses, so the lower classes live in apartments. And what happens when the middle class takes the apartments as well? Should the less fortunate build shanty towns to live in?

This isn't about people monopolizing some conveniences; access to housing is a human right (article 25), which is why governments regulate it.

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#24

Post by skulpter »

officemonkey wrote: post #14
ravenstine wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get that argument. Going by your logic, housing itself is classist because people who aren't at least in the middle class can't afford houses much of the time. And maybe it is, but then what? Are we supposed to abolish classism because some people are less fortunate?

It depends on what you think the best use of housing is. Is housing meant to "make money for the owner" or "provide housing for people?" There, I've just taken class out of the equation. Your answer?

Are clothes meant to “make money for manufacturers” or “provide warmth for people”

Is food meant to “make money for producers” or “provide nutrition for people”

None of these things are mutually exclusive. Otherwise, where do you draw the line?

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#25

Post by wyager »

cameronfraser wrote: post #11
Raed667 wrote: post #4

I live in touristy city, and I wish nothing more than to see Airbnb crash and die. Finding rent here is mission impossible, most landlords will happily rent to you for a contract that ends at the start of the summer, then you have to figure out where to live for 3 months. Housing prices are impossibly expensive compared to local salaries, and landlords would rather keep a place empty for an occasional airbnb than hav…

I agree, AirBnB is an unsustainable business and I would also like to see it regulated out of existence. It is extremely classist. Only something that middle class or higher can use while reducing housing availability which primarily impacts lower classes.

If you think it needs to be "regulated out of existence", it sounds like you think it actually is sustainable; you just don't like it.

> It is extremely classist. Only something that middle class or higher can use

So you think any business which isn't affordable to everyone should be shut down?

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#26

Post by wyager »

Raed667 wrote: post #4

I live in touristy city, and I wish nothing more than to see Airbnb crash and die. Finding rent here is mission impossible, most landlords will happily rent to you for a contract that ends at the start of the summer, then you have to figure out where to live for 3 months. Housing prices are impossibly expensive compared to local salaries, and landlords would rather keep a place empty for an occasional airbnb than hav…

> than have a full-time tenant (that has a lot of legal protection regarding eviction)

This sounds like a pretty convincing argument against laws that are extremely lopsided in favor of tenants. If you make renting out property an extremely high-risk proposition, of course property owners are going to prefer something less risky.

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#27

Post by matz1 »

officemonkey wrote: post #14
ravenstine wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get that argument. Going by your logic, housing itself is classist because people who aren't at least in the middle class can't afford houses much of the time. And maybe it is, but then what? Are we supposed to abolish classism because some people are less fortunate?

It depends on what you think the best use of housing is. Is housing meant to "make money for the owner" or "provide housing for people?" There, I've just taken class out of the equation. Your answer?

Best use of housing is whatever the owner think its best for. There is no single answer.

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#28

Post by cactus2093 »

skor wrote: post #20
ravenstine wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get that argument. Going by your logic, housing itself is classist because people who aren't at least in the middle class can't afford houses much of the time. And maybe it is, but then what? Are we supposed to abolish classism because some people are less fortunate?

I can give you an example. A cheap-to-rent apartment in a central part of an old popular city in Europe, is now a pricy Airbnb. This means that students, young families, people with lower income have to move out of a suburb they we born, studied, have friends, etc. And now have to find a place elsewhere on the outskirts, where tourists don't want to go. This is apart from arriving at your buildings front door and hav…

Airbnb makes the problem 10-20% worse, but almost no cities are building net positive housing compared to their growth. People getting priced out will continue to happen with or without Airbnb, until cities take housing seriously and build more.

Re: Ask HN: Will this be the end of Airbnb?

#30

Post by Raed667 »

wyager wrote: post #26
Raed667 wrote: post #4

I live in touristy city, and I wish nothing more than to see Airbnb crash and die. Finding rent here is mission impossible, most landlords will happily rent to you for a contract that ends at the start of the summer, then you have to figure out where to live for 3 months. Housing prices are impossibly expensive compared to local salaries, and landlords would rather keep a place empty for an occasional airbnb than hav…

> than have a full-time tenant (that has a lot of legal protection regarding eviction) This sounds like a pretty convincing argument against laws that are extremely lopsided in favor of tenants. If you make renting out property an extremely high-risk proposition, of course property owners are going to prefer something less risky.

I have to disagree there.

Feeling safe in your rented apartment from unjustified evictions, doubling rent without notice, or landlord trespassing etc.. is an absolute must.

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