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Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

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Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#21

Post by yolo42 »

bcx wrote: post #19

It sounds like the company wants to work with you to work out a good solution. How have they responded when you told them: * I'd like to keep roadmap control * I'd like to be compensated for the work I put in on my own time out side of work. (which is well documented from the commit logs, and the fact I wasn't using an employer owned computer) * I'd like to keep working on this on my own time outside of work. If you…

> I'd like to be compensated for the work I put in on my own time out side of work. (which is well documented from the commit logs, and the fact I wasn't using an employer owned computer)

The company overall is quite stingy and I doubt that they will do this part. I'm trying to figure out what other things that I can ask for other than financial compensation. Someone mentioned Promotion and a positive review is something to ask for, which makes some sense. The only problem is according to my review, I'm already exceeding expectations. So, this project doesn't buy me much.

Overall, they are fine, and kind of, want me to drive the project, essentially because there is no one else who can do that job.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#22

Post by yolo42 »

masukomi wrote: post #18

> I created product on the side as a side project in my own time and it has become a huge hit in the community to a point where my employers wants me to transfer the code-base over. The company does OSS and my side-project is also Open-Source. Let me restate this: You had an idea you were so interested in you created it in your off time. You made it open source. Your company likes it so much they want to contribute t…

It is not that they want me to spend work time on it. They want me to transfer ownership of the project to them. That's the part that I do not wish to do.

The way things work at this place, I'll probably end up maintaining the product until I leave my job.

The reason for not transferring over is that once I do that, they will essentially not let me create features that I think can be done better using my product, because they exist in some other product.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#23

Post by relaunched »

Find a lawyer, ASAP, that specializes in employment and / or IP. This is a legal issue and you need to solve it with people that know the law. Talking, signing, admitting things, etc, only hurt you.

Depending on your country and state, as well as your employment agreement, there are a lot of impactful variables. Intuition and personal relationships are not going to help you solve this issue, especially, absent knowing the law and your position.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#24

Post by john_moscow »

yolo42 wrote: post #21
bcx wrote: post #19

It sounds like the company wants to work with you to work out a good solution. How have they responded when you told them: * I'd like to keep roadmap control * I'd like to be compensated for the work I put in on my own time out side of work. (which is well documented from the commit logs, and the fact I wasn't using an employer owned computer) * I'd like to keep working on this on my own time outside of work. If you…

> I'd like to be compensated for the work I put in on my own time out side of work. (which is well documented from the commit logs, and the fact I wasn't using an employer owned computer) The company overall is quite stingy and I doubt that they will do this part. I'm trying to figure out what other things that I can ask for other than financial compensation. Someone mentioned Promotion and a positive review is somet…

From what I can tell, it's not a very big company, so they should be flexible. So I would try to turn the tables around and get a non-exclusive deal like this:

* The company agrees to pay you for adding some extra features to the project

* You keep control and exclusive rights, but give them a license to use it (but not transfer it to others)

Edit: even if they legally can claim full ownership of the project, you have the full right to resign and go work on something else after they do so. And if this is not what they want, you will have pretty good chances negotiating a non-exclusive deal instead.

One last piece of advice:

=== DO NOT AGREE TO ANYTHING WITHOUT A LAWYER ===

Many companies would consider it business as usual to agree on your terms verbally and then slip in a clause in the contract that would completely change the balance in their favor.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#25

Post by nilram »

yolo42 wrote: post #22
masukomi wrote: post #18

> I created product on the side as a side project in my own time and it has become a huge hit in the community to a point where my employers wants me to transfer the code-base over. The company does OSS and my side-project is also Open-Source. Let me restate this: You had an idea you were so interested in you created it in your off time. You made it open source. Your company likes it so much they want to contribute t…

It is not that they want me to spend work time on it. They want me to transfer ownership of the project to them. That's the part that I do not wish to do. The way things work at this place, I'll probably end up maintaining the product until I leave my job. The reason for not transferring over is that once I do that, they will essentially not let me create features that I think can be done better using my product, bec…

If you don’t want to, and won’t be fairly compensated for it, then how about using the word “No”?

I agree with others that talking with one or more lawyers should be a high priority.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#26

Post by awillen »

relaunched wrote: post #23

Find a lawyer, ASAP, that specializes in employment and / or IP. This is a legal issue and you need to solve it with people that know the law. Talking, signing, admitting things, etc, only hurt you. Depending on your country and state, as well as your employment agreement, there are a lot of impactful variables. Intuition and personal relationships are not going to help you solve this issue, especially, absent knowin…

Listen to this person. The people telling you to talk to your employer are giving you terrible advice. You can still do that after spending 30 minutes with a lawyer, but you can't take back anything you say before you talk to a lawyer.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#27

Post by monocasa »

yolo42 wrote: post #14
buboard wrote: post #11

Would they still be interested if it was gpl?

I should have thought about GPL when I released the code. But, that boat has sailed. Could they change the license later on if it is initially GPL? I'm thinking about the next project that I'll be doing so that I don't repeat the same mistake.

For the future, I would totally read Social Architecture. It's available here for free (libre and gratis), and is not long, 100 pages or so printed. https://hintjens.gitbooks.io/social-architecture/content/

A huge part of that is how to structure an open source project so that it can't be taken from the community. Basically a combo of GPL and taking community contributions without having them assign copyright to you is the most full proof way to keep something open source.

To answer your question, if they own everything they can relicense it any way they see fit. Only by having your code mixed with others' that you don't own can you practically protect it from forced relicensing.

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#28

Post by leetrout »

JohnFen wrote: post #12
mcv wrote: post #6

Whether or not your employer can claim ownership in court depends entirely on your contract. But no matter what's in your contact, that route is probably not your best option. From what I understand, you created, in your own time, a project that is valuable to your employer, and that they want to use and develop. You're the expert on this project. Not just that, you designed every aspect of it, popularised it, and yo…

> Whether or not your employer can claim ownership in court depends entirely on your contract. Entirely this. I got burned by this years ago, developing side project that was completely unrelated to the sort of work my employer did, and was not developed using any company resources. But my employment contract specified that my employer had first rights to anything I developed at all during the term of my employment.…

What state were you in?

Re: Ask HN: My company wants my side project. What can I do?

#29

Post by caseysoftware »

relaunched wrote: post #23

Find a lawyer, ASAP, that specializes in employment and / or IP. This is a legal issue and you need to solve it with people that know the law. Talking, signing, admitting things, etc, only hurt you. Depending on your country and state, as well as your employment agreement, there are a lot of impactful variables. Intuition and personal relationships are not going to help you solve this issue, especially, absent knowin…

Exactly this.

And when you sit down with the lawyer, make sure to bring your employment contract and IP agreement. They'll need those to give you any informed opinions.

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