Ask HN: How do you manage your manager? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#21

Post by biztos » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 2:17 AM UTC

> asked by my manager not to give talks

This is really missing some context: were you asked to not give the talks because of their content? Were you denied budget to go to the events, which would be a completely different thing? What reason did your manager give for the request?

As a general point, you should consider what your manager wants to achieve, and to the extent it doesn't contradict your own goals or ethics, help them achieve that. If no such alignment is possible, CTRL+ALT+DEL.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#22

Post by RickJWagner » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 2:19 AM UTC

I just give my manager my honest best 40 hours for that week.

I don't want to work beyond that (though sometimes it just has to be done), and I sometimes have weeks where I'm just tired/lazy/not well and don't give a good 40. But I always try.

Using that formula I've managed to always have good relations with my managers-- this is my 28th year in the business, over 3 companies and several managers in each.

Oh, about the speaking gigs. (I've had a few of these too, and only once lost the opportunity to go. That one was a foreign event and wasn't really in my strong suit.) I'd use that as a bargaining chip in your periodic reviews. When the manager talks about your performance, mention going to one of these shows as a benchmark. I wouldn't try to use a minor show-- make it J1 (or whatever it's called these days), MSFT Build, RH Summit, etc. Something that means something. If the manager balks, I'd seriously consider bringing it up in a group-level meeting. Upper managers almost always offer a Q&A session, you can have a cleverly worded question prepared in advance. It's hard to claim to be a world-class company when you don't let you people go to world-class gatherings, so you should find some traction there. Good luck.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#23

Post by lemmicide » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 2:23 AM UTC

Make sure they work in the same time zone, for one.

Two, your guy seems to be throttling your notoriety. Flip that fucker the bird, and if he give you static, quit on that bastard.

The problem you’ve got right here is as old as the Molly MaGuires.

Are you exposing trade secrets? No? Then someone simply doesn’t want to be outshined.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#24

Post by timdellinger » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 2:27 AM UTC

You should be aware of your boss's goals, and his/her boss's goals (which are often written down and reviewed annually), and your organization's goals and mission statement. If the conference is aligned with these goals, you have a case.

You should also have a professional development plan in place with your boss, so that he/she knows the ways in which you're putting time into growing yourself professionally, and so that he/she can steer opportunities your way and help you achieve what you've got your eye on. If presenting at industry events is "on your list", it should be On Your List, i.e. written down and reviewed annually.

For managers, professional development of their direct reports is often one of their goals.

I'm from the No Surprises school of thought - you don't want surprises from your manager, and your manager doesn't want surprises from you.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#25

Post by maxxxxx » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 2:31 AM UTC

I generally avoid talking too much with my managers. I usually do without asking what I think is right without getting permission (better ask for forgiveness later which rarely happens). When asked I will tell them what's going on but without asking I am quiet and do my job. When my team has to work with other teams I also talk to them directly without manager if possible. This works well for me.

Other people have the opposite approach always talking to their manager and trying to develop a relationship. From what I see this only works for some. In the end they want somebody who does the necessary work and causes the manager as little work as possible. It's pretty rare that a manager actually mentors people to get better.

As far as asked not to give talks it seems pretty clear that your manager doesn't have your best interest at heart.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#26

Post by aventador » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 2:56 AM UTC

It is taught at university. However, the courses you require are typically found in MALS and DLA programs. Studying classics (i.e., dead white guys, like Plutarch), rhetoric, methodology, and conflict resolution will help to grow your perspective in how to best influence others.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#27

Post by lgleason » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 3:04 AM UTC

Bad/inexperienced managers/team leads can make a great job a miserable experience. I usually leave those positions for better jobs vs trying to train someone who is supposed to be my "superior". The not giving talks at certain industry events seems odd unless there is a company policy around that due to IP issues etc..

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#28

Post by frisco » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 3:21 AM UTC

greggarious wrote: post #14

confiscate wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

agree. Especially with #3 "understand what boss wants" From the way OP phrased the question, it sounded like the OP felt the manager "owed" the OP. As in, OP feels going to the conference is a must, "a given", a "constitutional right", and that the manager "wronged" him by not letting him go. It's a very childish way of viewing the world. As in, I deserve to go to Disneyland. My mom won't let me, so I will now get a…

> OP feels going to the conference is a must, "a given", a "constitutional right", and that the manager "wronged" him by not letting him go. It's a very childish way of viewing the world. OP's employer does not own them - they have a right to a private life. While they certainly could not want OP identifying themselves as an agent of their employer when giving a talk, OP is entitled to use their free time / vacation…

That's true as long as they're not talking about their work at the conference. I assume they would be?

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#29

Post by ilkan » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 3:29 AM UTC

Imho odds are your manager is right. Are you working for a 3 letter agency, its contractor or subcontractor; are you revealing trade secrets or company priorities, or implying them by revealing your knowledge on a subject; are you using your role as employee of company X to land paid speaking roles; have you signed employment agreements that state any intellectual property you create on or off the job is property of the company; are you speaking at event which could bring suspicion or disrepute to your employer eg blackhat, scammy, or events sponsored by foreign powers; do you work in finance and are being paid an amount in cash or in perks (transport, meals) which invites scrutiny for ethical violations; do you work in a sensitive or "access" position which has required you to sign a code of conduct? What's the reason for denial? Context is necessary.

Re: Ask HN: How do you manage your manager?

#30

Post by confiscate » Fri, Jun 15, 2018, 3:36 AM UTC

greggarious wrote: post #14

confiscate wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

agree. Especially with #3 "understand what boss wants" From the way OP phrased the question, it sounded like the OP felt the manager "owed" the OP. As in, OP feels going to the conference is a must, "a given", a "constitutional right", and that the manager "wronged" him by not letting him go. It's a very childish way of viewing the world. As in, I deserve to go to Disneyland. My mom won't let me, so I will now get a…

> OP feels going to the conference is a must, "a given", a "constitutional right", and that the manager "wronged" him by not letting him go. It's a very childish way of viewing the world. OP's employer does not own them - they have a right to a private life. While they certainly could not want OP identifying themselves as an agent of their employer when giving a talk, OP is entitled to use their free time / vacation…

Agree 100%.

OP can go to conference, in his/her "own time". OP is an adult and does not need an OK from manager to go to the conference in his/her private life.

But, OP cannot expect the manager to give the OK. OP is not "entitled" to an automatic OK. The manager does not owe OP an OK.