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Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

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Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#191

Post by rahimnathwani »

rammy1234 wrote: post #190
rahimnathwani wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are, of course, correct. But people often choose whether or not to take something personally, and their reaction determines the outcome. Consider the following situations: A. (Bad case) You criticise my idea/proposal, and I interpret that as you criticising/shaming/blaming me (i.e. I take it personally). I then decide to ignore your criticism, because I feel it is based on your personal opinion of me, which I kno…

people reacting to situations is about individual. but we know every individual is unique and different. Team should be encompassing and not assuming. CEO or Project Director's boundary is only with the idea and not the individual. Idea can be criticised, never individual. Your argument may sound right, but it is not considering everyone. Your argument is saying how one should react, but is not answering what if one…

As I said before, you are correct :)

And I always aim to criticise the work/behaviour and not the person.

However:

- When I criticise a piece of work, someone can still choose to interpret it as shaming or a personal attack.

- When someone criticises me personally, I can still choose to focus on the useful part. I don't have to feel offended/upset.

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#192

Post by rammy1234 »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #191
rammy1234 wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

people reacting to situations is about individual. but we know every individual is unique and different. Team should be encompassing and not assuming. CEO or Project Director's boundary is only with the idea and not the individual. Idea can be criticised, never individual. Your argument may sound right, but it is not considering everyone. Your argument is saying how one should react, but is not answering what if one…

As I said before, you are correct :) And I always aim to criticise the work/behaviour and not the person. However: - When I criticise a piece of work, someone can still choose to interpret it as shaming or a personal attack. - When someone criticises me personally, I can still choose to focus on the useful part. I don't have to feel offended/upset.

When I criticise a piece of work, someone can still choose to interpret it as shaming or a personal attack. -- yes agree. this is not the mistake of the person commenting.

When someone criticises me personally, I can still choose to focus on the useful part. I don't have to feel offended/upset.

- This as mentioned before, this we cannot make a rule but a guidance but this is very personal to the individual and most inidividual even if he is not offended, will not work under him for a long time to come. which is not good either way.

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#193

Post by [deleted] »

noir_lord wrote: post #112
kreetx wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's good to hear how well how it has worked out for you! My situation isn't exactly as good, but it's getting there I'm hoping. The current job I have started out as part time so that I could work on my side project. This didn't work out but then I suddenly got more trust and freedom for doing things my own way, and now it's much better.

If I could go back and say one thing to 18 year old me it would be "it's better to seek forgiveness than ask permission", every single time I've made the bold choice it's either worked out or I've learnt something from it. I far more regret the things I didn't do. It's good they are rewarding trust earned with more trust, that's rare in a lot of work places.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#194

Post by travis86 »

xivzgrev wrote: post #76

My current one. The company treats people like...well people. -transparent communication -soliciting feedback often -an ethos of "take care of yourself, your family, then the company", manifesting in flexible WFH situations -lots of investment in personal development / growth -an emphasis on bridging gaps / empathizing / assuming positive intent in working with others At pretty much every other company I've ever work…

Your company sounds like somewhere I'd like to work. If you are comfortable with it, could you email me the name? My email address is in my profile.

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#195

Post by kreetx »

noir_lord wrote: post #112
kreetx wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's good to hear how well how it has worked out for you! My situation isn't exactly as good, but it's getting there I'm hoping. The current job I have started out as part time so that I could work on my side project. This didn't work out but then I suddenly got more trust and freedom for doing things my own way, and now it's much better.

If I could go back and say one thing to 18 year old me it would be "it's better to seek forgiveness than ask permission", every single time I've made the bold choice it's either worked out or I've learnt something from it. I far more regret the things I didn't do. It's good they are rewarding trust earned with more trust, that's rare in a lot of work places.

Same here on the bold choices. My two "mistakes" (not actually regretting -- everybody has their own path) were staying at the academy too long, and secondly not asking at all, but expecting. Not smart, and actually rather neurotic.

What I've found out just in the last few years is that by making yourself valuable and then asking for what you really want will actually bring the thing to you (if it's reasonable). Preparing the question and paths forward for both outcomes is a way better strategy than losing hope and blowing up.

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#196

Post by PeterisP »

rammy1234 wrote: post #150
rahimnathwani wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a PM and didn't have any negative feeling when I read that part of the comment. I was reflecting a bit on why. I think it's three things: 1. If I've not done my job as a PM, then it's much better to figure it out earlier rather than later. If engineers struggle on without the right support from a PM (whether that's stories/requirements, oral clarification, ...) then that can slow things down or create worse outco…

shaming is not criticism. criticism is an expression of disapproval of an idea not the person. But shaming is personal. This is not constructive to improve.

If a proposal is bad because the idea has flaws, it's appropriate to express disapproval of the idea.

If a proposal is bad because a decent idea is lazily written (as the original post states), it's appropriate to express disapproval at the person - if the only thing that was needed to change in order to make this proposal better was the person's attitude (do your homework properly before submitting the proposal instead of wasting everyone else's time), then it is constructive to target that attitude.

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#197

Post by jodrellblank »

scarface74 wrote: post #170
jacques_chester wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do if I'm about to do it wrong, or if something other than a loop might be better, or to write the test that drives it out, or to show me a trick I didn't know, or to get me unstuck, or to tell me there's a library function that lets us skip a loop, or ... Is your argument that I don't know how pairing works? Because my estimate is that I have around 8,000 hours practicing it at this point, which I suspect may be 8…

I’ve been writing code for over 30 years including two assembly language instruction sets (one before going to high school), and C on 4 platforms. I’ve been using my preferred language C# for a decade and JavaScript since it was introduced by Netscape in the 90s. I think I’m capable of writing decent performant code without pairing....

I think I’m capable of writing decent performant code without pairing....

You think you are, but you've never tested this thought and scoff at the idea that you could be wrong, despite being told from experienced people who have tested it that you are wrong?

Is your argument seriously "I've never done it, but it doesn't work" to someone saying "I've done lots of it and it works well"?

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#198

Post by scarface74 »

jodrellblank wrote: post #197
scarface74 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve been writing code for over 30 years including two assembly language instruction sets (one before going to high school), and C on 4 platforms. I’ve been using my preferred language C# for a decade and JavaScript since it was introduced by Netscape in the 90s. I think I’m capable of writing decent performant code without pairing....

I think I’m capable of writing decent performant code without pairing.... You think you are, but you've never tested this thought and scoff at the idea that you could be wrong, despite being told from experienced people who have tested it that you are wrong? Is your argument seriously "I've never done it, but it doesn't work" to someone saying "I've done lots of it and it works well"?

Again, seeing that my first experience as a hobbyist was rewriting programs in assembly in the 80s that were too slow in higher languages on a 1Mhz 65C02 based computer, my second job as a professional was dissecting C compiler output to see how I could optimize the code generated or at times rewrite it in x86 assembly (custom printer drivers for industrial printers) and my third job was optimizing a proprietary compiler/IDE for Windows Mobile devices. I think I have a little more experience optimizing code than someone who has been doing it “for six years”.

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#199

Post by jodrellblank »

scarface74 wrote: post #198
jodrellblank wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I’m capable of writing decent performant code without pairing.... You think you are, but you've never tested this thought and scoff at the idea that you could be wrong, despite being told from experienced people who have tested it that you are wrong? Is your argument seriously "I've never done it, but it doesn't work" to someone saying "I've done lots of it and it works well"?

Again, seeing that my first experience as a hobbyist was rewriting programs in assembly in the 80s that were too slow in higher languages on a 1Mhz 65C02 based computer, my second job as a professional was dissecting C compiler output to see how I could optimize the code generated or at times rewrite it in x86 assembly (custom printer drivers for industrial printers) and my third job was optimizing a proprietary comp…

This is finding your identity as a performance programmer challenged, and defending your identity instead.

"That sounds stupid, but they claim it's good, so I'll try it and see if I can learn anything".

"look at my credentials, don't question me, this other person can't know anything I don't, how dare anyone suggest I can learn anything from anyone else, don't you know who I am? Also they're a n00b."

Re: Ask HN: What company environment has enabled your best work?

#200

Post by scarface74 »

jodrellblank wrote: post #199
scarface74 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, seeing that my first experience as a hobbyist was rewriting programs in assembly in the 80s that were too slow in higher languages on a 1Mhz 65C02 based computer, my second job as a professional was dissecting C compiler output to see how I could optimize the code generated or at times rewrite it in x86 assembly (custom printer drivers for industrial printers) and my third job was optimizing a proprietary comp…

This is finding your identity as a performance programmer challenged, and defending your identity instead. "That sounds stupid, but they claim it's good, so I'll try it and see if I can learn anything". "look at my credentials, don't question me, this other person can't know anything I don't, how dare anyone suggest I can learn anything from anyone else, don't you know who I am? Also they're a n00b."

You act as if I’ve never sat with another developer brainstorming which is different than constant pair programming. I wasn’t the one who bragged about six whole years of experience
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