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Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

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Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#161
I have a PhD in Economics and was a Finance professor for a few years before realizing that life in the academe wouldn't suit my skills. I now work in Data Science and couldn't be happier.

The question of, "is it worth it?" is complex and only can be answered for yourself.

Most people will say that if you don't plan on working in academia that the PhD will lead to a suboptimal career income. You could spend that 4+ years building your skills working for a company and end up earning considerably more. The other side effect is that there is a definite bias against PhDs for most jobs in industry.

For me, it was all about the journey and I wouldn't change any of it for the world. Any decent PhD program will expand your horizons more than nearly anything else. There is no way I would be in the same position now without my previous experiences. I do have to say though that my "detour" through grad school and being a professor means that I didn't start earning real money until my mid 30s and puts me financially behind some friends of mine who started earlier. Seriously though, the experience was amazing as it expanded so much about how I think about the world.

If you do a PhD, you should be doing it for yourself and your own learning. If you do it for the title/paycheck, there are far better ways to get there.

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#162
Currently doing a CS PhD at Stanford. If you have no interest in becoming a professor/researcher and don't like to do research, there is very little reason to do a PhD. The PhD is actually a training program for doing research much moreso than another degree to learn more specialized knowledge. You don't need a PhD to keep learning. So i'd suggest trying to go into industry, but positioning yourself to be able to keep learning cutting edge stuff.

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you on the point that money is overemphasized, but does a PhD really mean you're more likely to add great value to history and humankind?

Yes, that is basically the job description; the point of a PhD is to contribute new knowledge.

PhD's doesn't contribute new knowledge, they contribute knowledge that can't be proven to be old.

It might sound similar, but it is not. Let me explain the difference:

A person performs a study creating lots of data. If he wanted to contribute to human knowledge he would publish the data with no comments, as he is probably not the best person in the world to analyze this data. If on the other hand he was a PhD he would not publish the data, instead he would publish some pet theories related to the data so that he can build his brand, and most of all he will absolutely not publish the data since it could possibly be used to prove that his pet theories are not relevant or maybe even wrong which would be disastrous for his brand.

Now there are of course PhD's who do the right thing but it doesn't benefit their career at all.

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#164

I have a PhD (in mech engineering) and work in industry. My experience was that I basically had to pick up a new physics set and tool set every year as I jumped from algorithm development, to constitutive model development, machine learning, and quantum computing. In all cases they were tackling problems in different areas: new toolset to learn, new math to learn and new physics to learn. I thoroughly enjoy working o…

> Advice: Get a job, the PhD will be waiting for you in 2 years if you decide you want it then. Plus it sounds like you are thinking about getting a PhD because looking for a job is hard.

Almost no one who takes that advice returns to get a PhD, the income is too hard to give up and often life moves on which makes it hard to take the financial hit and devote the time.

The only way it worked for me was to not need much money (tuition covered and receive a stipend) and have 80+ hours a week to geek out over things that interested me. Absolutely no way I could do that now with kids. That may be one of the reasons almost everyone in my program was in their mid 20s, and the hand full in their 50s after their kids went off to college.

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#165
Given what you said especially in your last paragraph, I would advise against pursuing a PhD right now.

However, I don't think that going for an industry job now would "surrender your chances for a PhD". I also got a MSc in computer science, then I worked in the industry for 5 years before going back to academia and start a PhD. Depending on your field, this can be a more or less dauting process.

Working in the industry before going back to a PhD has a number of pros:

- you can make a better decision about what you want to do because you have actual industry experience

- you can save some money for your PhD

Cons:

- Going from an industry salary to a PhD salary is really sad

- The process of getting accepted in a PhD program after you've left academia for a number of years can be difficult (but not impossible!)

You seem to be quite sick of student life during your MSc, so be aware that during a PhD it is about the same or worse. Getting yourself an industry job now can let you breathe some air and make a better decision about what you want to do next.

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#166

There are plenty of PHD's who lead thoroughly uninteresting lives, there are plenty that have exciting and meaningful lives. Your degree isn't what makes your life interesting or not, nor is your job title, nor is your job, nor is how much you get paid. The premise of the question is wrong, IMHO. If you're "not sure" about the PHD, take some time off and work for a couple years in something challenging and then decid…

> Your degree isn't what makes your life interesting or not, nor is your job title, nor is your job, nor is how much you get paid.

So a day laborer in India has equal chance at "interesting life" than a researcher at google ?

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#167
I was thinking of getting a PhD 4 years ago. I applied and got accepted to CMU master's program in robotic vision. I planned to go through the program and worked my way to get into a good PhD program because I didn't have enough credential to apply directly to good PhD programs. After thinking through it, I decided not to even do the master's.

Throughout my thinking process, I spent everyday and lots of weekends sitting at coffee shops crunching through research papers. And what I found was that a lot of of the papers were not directly relevant to the industries, it's just like what somebody said in the comments: a lot of research projects are like trying to hammer a square peg into a circle hole. I'm sure some of them will make great impact. For example, the research about neural network had been done since the 80s, it just happens to take off nowadays because computers back then weren't good enough. But when I asked myself: "What am I really looking for?" I realized that I wanted to work on something that makes an immediate impact. Especially because I grew up and raised in a developing country, a lot of problems here are super immediate. (i.e. poverty, hunger, lack of educations, etc) As so much as I'm genuinely curious and interested in many of the research topics, I realized that my stamina didn't lie in curiosity and interest alone, but more in the immediate impact I'm making. For example, I learned that I'm much more fulfilled to work on something super practical and can be immediately useful to people.

Even though I didn't end up doing a PhD, I still occasionally spend my time reading conference papers. My curiosity and interest are pretty much satisfied through that. I'm much more interested in exploring interesting applications of such ingenious research rather than doing going super deep in a particular topic and be the one doing the research. Magic Pony Technology is one of the companies I look up to. I think it's a brilliant way of turning research into something practical

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#168
There is no piece of paper that will ever give you the permission all of us humans seem to desire from the universe.

Get out. Go to a place you like. Do what you like there. Permission is given by doing.

Or in short, if you have to ask if a PhD is the right thing to pursue, it's not. :) have fun and enjoy life! good luck!

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#169

I have a Ph.D. in CS from the University of Washington. I'm glad I did it, but it's not for most people. Academic research is like a marathon and the Ph.D. is like a marathon training program. If you don't want to run a marathon, you probably don't need a marathon training program. Yes, a marathon training program is an interesting and rewarding way to improve your running, but it's very likely you can find equally i…

4 years ago I cold emailed and phoned you to ask for advice regarding PhD program. I followed your advice and ended up not pursuing a PhD. And yeah, I think you're totally right :) so yeah, thanks again for answering my cold-email and willing to have a phone call with me 4 years ago!

Re: Ask HN: Will getting a PhD lead to a more interesting life?

#170

CS PhD from Stanford in dynamic program analysis. Lost all my friends. Ghosted by companies for jobs directly related to my research. Everyone I knew who went directly into industry is doing way better than me. My salary has only tracked inflation. I sorely regret the decision and consider it to have fundamentally ruined my life beyond repair.

Imagine telling any of the thousands of homeless people in the Bay Area that a Stanford PhD program “ruined my life beyond repair”. Maybe it is a lack of general life experience that is holding you back.

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