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Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

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Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#151

Post by knorker »

travisporter wrote: post #93
knorker wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are two good reasons why Grace Hoppen should not be used as an example. 1. You are (likely) not Grace Hopper. 2. Computer science was, in a way, much easier back then. At least very different. Listen to the Brian Kernighan being interviewed by Lex Fridman; he keeps repeating that you didn't have to be as awesome back in his days, using himself as an example. Saying "If Grace hopper can do it, then so can I" is…

But (1) is suggesting only a woman at that age with those life experiences could have done what she did. I don’t see why that has to be empirically true

It's not how I meant it.

She had the experience, education, skill, and drive to succeed when she was put in the right place at the right time. I was with (1) mostly referring to education, skill, and drive.

But also If you were a PhD in math in 1934 and wanted to switch to computers, then you were not "competing" with a bunch of people who'd been doing computers since they were 5, because nobody had.

Parent post said she went to computers in ~1945, which is just two years after "I think there's a world market for maybe five computers".

None of that is transferrable to just anybody's career change decision.

With (1) I could have also said that Ricky Gervais went into comedy at close to 40 years old. But you're not Ricky Gervais, so it's not likely to work out for you.

It's partly a lottery win, too, where you don't need certain life experiences to win.

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#152

Post by NikolaNovak »

WastingMyTime89 wrote: post #86

In my admittedly still short life, I have started to notice something: you can broadly divide the world into two groups - those who do things and those who keep wondering if they should have done things. So for what’s worth, here is my advice to you: drop Gladwell and self-help books, if you want to and can switch to a new job, do it. Should it work or fail, you will have experienced trying. If you don’t feel like it…

I agree with some points of it.

However, some people (loosely correlated with age but not strictly) have more unavoidable responsibilities than others. For a very prosaic example, a person without mortgage and kids, all other things equal will have inherently less responsibilities than one with mortgage and kids (while both still have options in principle).

Empathy is a massive skill I've been learning late in life; reluctance to embark on a change may be a factor of internal confidence, external advice or validation, but also of specific circumstances that those of us being asked opinions may or may not fully share, understand, empathize with. I've been learning to ask follow-up questions before answering very broad inquiries for thoughts and advice: What's your situation, constraints, drive, interest, priorities, goals?

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#153

Post by david422 »

WastingMyTime89 wrote: post #86

In my admittedly still short life, I have started to notice something: you can broadly divide the world into two groups - those who do things and those who keep wondering if they should have done things. So for what’s worth, here is my advice to you: drop Gladwell and self-help books, if you want to and can switch to a new job, do it. Should it work or fail, you will have experienced trying. If you don’t feel like it…

> those who do things and those who keep wondering if they should have done things.

Yea, I've realized that if I want to do something - some goal - if you don't literally _just do it_ then odds of it happening become slimmer and slimmer.

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#154

Post by michaelcao »

just_boost_it wrote: post #147
toss1 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

YES!! If you have a deep interest and anything resembling the skills required, go for it. Perseverance is the most important characteristic. That said, Gladwell is completely FOS about the 10,000 hours — it bears repeating completely Full Of Sh*t. Not only is "mastery" ill-defined, but so is what counts as "practice", and it completely ignores that some people will after 10K hours fail to get to the top, and others c…

Gladwell's english was very approachable, so outliers was an easy and enjoyable book to read. I even believed it the first time I read it. Once I read his later stuff though, I noticed a couple of things that didn't quite add up for me, and that sort of shone a light for me on the pattern he was using. I wouldn't put any more weight on his work now than I would on a random blog from the depths of the internet.

He's a genius writer and we should be aware of that when reading his books. He could influence us. I think that 10000 hours means that long-term. No shortcut for master anything.

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#155

Post by michaelcao »

daveevad wrote: post #132
iainctduncan wrote: post #114

The Gladwell book is so bad it's laughable. It's a gross misrepresentation of the work of Anders Ericsson, with completely unfounded extrapolations. So bad it prompted Ericsson to get a non-academic writer to work with him to write his own popular science version of his work, which is titled "Peak". Outliers is the worst example I know of of popular authors bending facts to make a narrative they want to tell. In a nu…

My favorite Gladwell book to rip on is Blink. It is 296 pages long and the main point was one only needs a few moments to understand complicated things.

I haven't read the Blink yet. I will try to read it in the near future. Thanks for mentioning it.

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#156

Post by Zensynthium »

Derek from Veritasium had a pretty good video on becoming an expert in anything and I didn't see age as a blocking factor. I'd say go for it! Also check out the video here, it's worth a watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eW6Eagr9XA

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#157

Post by crispyambulance »

Whether you can successfully switch career is up to you and how you define "career".

I think the most underestimated "hard part" of mastering something new is that the path to mastery often looks like one failure after another. A long string of incompetence that makes one appear like a cargo-culting dilettante who keeps trying even as it appears they aren't getting anywhere. This is hard for folks to take, especially later in their careers. One has to have a thick skin to get through it.

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#158

Post by michaelcao »

tgv wrote: post #15

My opinion: * The 10000 hour rule is nonsense. There are skills that require very much practice, and a lot of those are unattainable for most people. You could practice 10,000 hours on the violin or playing chess without reaching the lofty heights of Hahn or Magnusson. That does require some kind of "talent". * Many other skills can be acquired in much less time, certainly if you don't start from scratch. E.g., learn…

He means no shortcuts for master anything. It takes time, 2000 or 3000 hours or any numbers. People tends to find a shortcut for anything, fox example, buying crypto to get rich quick. I agree that 10000 hours rule is a myth.

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#159

Post by swamp40 »

michaelcao wrote: post #155
daveevad wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favorite Gladwell book to rip on is Blink. It is 296 pages long and the main point was one only needs a few moments to understand complicated things.

I haven't read the Blink yet. I will try to read it in the near future. Thanks for mentioning it.

I suspect he was joking...

Re: Ask HN: 10k hours rule to master anything. Could I switch career when I am 43?

#160

Post by ghost-towels »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #149
andrew_ wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The older I get the more I recognize that most of the people I've encountered, in one way or another, have a great lack of confidence and courage.

Meh. You can be as confident as you like, if people won't take on staff as "juniors" who are older, then the whole process of retraining - wrt career change - has been a waste of time. I've never been involved in corporate HR, I'd want advice. Similarly, if I was doing a bungee jump for the first time I'd ask someone to check my harness ... (to spell it out, you seem to be berating someone for doing a reality check,…

This is pretty much where I’m at. I’m mid 40s and been working in the marine industry for almost 30 years (yes I started that young). I’m going for a career change but I have zero experience in a corporate/modern office setting. I am also self taught. It will be a huge change, and I’m concerned that I may not be hireable. All that being said I’m still going for it as I’d like the rest of my working days actually helping society instead of old white dudes and their boats haha. I’m looking into security/osint.
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