Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

news.ycombinator.com

151–160 of 214 posts

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#151
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Worker ownership of the means of production ( i.e. democracy at work) is an alternative and that's most certainly not what you lived through, nor did you live through a stateless, classless and moneyless society. What you lived through was fascism with red flags. If you check the sidebar of that subreddit you'll find anarchism and mutualism as the solutions to the problems it identifies.

*Solutions that nobody anywhere has ever implemented successfully.

All of human history was workers controlling the means of their production until about 10,000 years ago, when class society was introduced in parts of the world, with one class who worked, and an idle class that did not, expropriating surplus labor time from those who worked.

Unexplained labor still exists deep in the Amazon and elsewhere, but mining companies finding new traces of valuable minerals are extinguishing the last of the old free way.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#152
Many of the comments here are pointing out the pluses in a SWE job. But for the most part it's as they say "Putting lipstick on a pig" If you don't like the job there is very little anyone can point out to make it better. My suggestion is to start looking for a new career to get into. The advantage of being a software guy is that you can get paid well. Which gives you the opportunity to work for a bit earn enough money to then try other careers.

Plan to move but start now.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#153
post #34

As the comments already reflect, HN is biased. My advice: get a second opinion somewhere else. It's not just you, in fact a lot of people are having the same thoughts inside and outside of software engineering. I'm one of them, as I just quit a SWE role to pursue literally anything else. We only have so much time on this Earth. Don't let anyone try to convince you that "the economy" is worth working for. Your happine…

Absolutely. I feel there's a lot social pressure involved in accepting to dedicate half our waking time and most of our mental energy to jobs that in no way we'd choose to do if it wasn't for the money.

Not only are many (most?) of SWE jobs quite questionable in their value, but they are also very inefficient in my experience, at least in bigger organizations. So you're not only dealing with the dissatisfaction of doing something that's pretty meh (at best), but also with the boredom of being super inefficient and knowing you could do so much more with your time.

Of course, we're all free to leave and do something else. But it's not easy to go against the current.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#154
Seems like this thread has highlighted at least two type of relationships people have with their job. Those who’ve accepted the seemingly Faustian bargain of working at something they accept is meaningless. These people treat work as just that and don’t attempt to derive much value from it other than the sustenance it provides. In the other camp are those who have found work they find deeply meaningful, often at the expense of their own financial interest. For those in the latter camp, can you share what you are working on? Curious to learn.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#155
post #54

Don’t agree with most of these comments. Not wanting to work at a company that makes some uninteresting business product just a little more profitable does not mean that you are depressed. Working at a place like that can certainly make you depressed though! To the OP, I think you have a few options. On one hand you can keep taking short jobs / consulting or try to build some sort of simple SaaS business that you can…

Basing your happiness from your work life is a recipe for unhappiness. You will always find something to nitpick about

Work satisfaction is a large component of happiness, as we spend a lot of our time at work (nearly half our waking hours). It's important not to neglect other aspects of your life and base your self-worth and happiness on work alone, but it's important to ensure you are happy at work.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#156
post #8

Yes, it is you (and few others). What you are experiencing is best described as depression. Been in a similar situation as you once. Of course the most important step is acknowledging that you need help otherwise that feeling will persist. Sometimes the source of the depression has not so much to do with your work life but has deeper roots.

This is such a kafkaesque comment. "See this horror you are gazing upon? the trouble with you is you refuse to see how this horror is indeed a good thing! It is you who suffer from a sickness, and until you see this horror for the good thing it is you will continue to be unwell"

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#157
This resonates with me bc I've been feeling down lately, although I'm on the other side of the fence; coasting along in a boring + pointless but well paying job.

> People who work 8 hours a day, mostly for a paycheck, how do you cope without wanting to off yourself?

1. Living isn't free. Unless you own and operate your own farm, someone right now is doing work to make it possible for you and I to live. Cavemen since the dawn of time had to forage and fight to survive. (I regard millionaires and the like as exceptions to the rule, most of us don't have access to the factors that enable someone to become a millionaire.)

2. Work will set you free. Or rather, freedom is an illusion. You're constrained by society, nature, etc. no matter what you do. Not having the responsibility to work every day doesn't make you more free or your life more meaningful. Alternatively, money gives you a lot more options and choices.

3. You should want to live your best possible life, and working towards that requires effort. Nobody really wants to work for someone other than themselves, but building your own revenue streams is hard so trading labor is a decent compromise. Money is a means to an end.

4. Work is an outlet for you to feel useful. You may regard a given job as pointless, but someone is paying for it. Someone values you and your labor. It's nice to be payed and praised for it.

5. It's not all about work. It's possible to earn and still have a life you enjoy outside of that. Cultivating that balance takes effort.

6. We have it _really_ good compared to the other 99% of the labor market. My GF works in corporate law, which is a particularly nasty counter example. She earns about 10% more than me, but puts in about 60% more hours than I do. In fact, she's on her computer working right now.

7. Some amount of suffering in life is unavoidable. Working is hard, but so is being unemployed. Pain avoidance is a tough bias to overcome. Making peace with the inevitable gives some strength in facing it.

> People who have really great jobs(not talking about money ofc), how did you find them?

I said how I consider my current job boring + pointless.. but it's a hell of a lot better than my last job, and the job before that.

Big things start small.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#158
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Worker ownership of the means of production ( i.e. democracy at work) is an alternative and that's most certainly not what you lived through, nor did you live through a stateless, classless and moneyless society. What you lived through was fascism with red flags. If you check the sidebar of that subreddit you'll find anarchism and mutualism as the solutions to the problems it identifies.

*Solutions that nobody anywhere has ever implemented successfully.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#159
post #31

I’ve thought that a lot recently too. I often look into SWE jobs, companies that announce funding, or I notice a “somebody got a new job” alert on LinkedIn. It seems 90% of the time the company involved in the above scenarios is some sort of “marketing analytics platform to grab more insight from your customers allowing you to make actionable decisions!” Again. And again, and again. Why does it seem like there are 2…

I think there are a lot of answers to your "why" question. But one important answer is that when product quality plateaus at a level good enough for most users, then marketing becomes the main differentiator and the main way to increase revenues and profits.

As an example, think about Coke vs Pepsi vs everybody else who makes a cola. The products are very stable and basically equivalent. So billions get spent on manipulating customers. That means plenty of opportunity to create tools that aid in that manipulation. (Which is already an ethical grey zone, so it's no shock that people will go further.)

To me, and I'd imagine to you, this is absurdly pointless and wasteful. I'd be perfectly happy to ban most advertising, freeing up hundreds of billions per year, plus untold amounts of human time and attention. But for people who just want to make money, they seem willing to look past the vast waste.

I think the solution is to find work in areas beyond the markets where a few dominant companies are engaged in trench warfare over customers for stagnant, good-enough products.

Re: Ask HN: Is it just me or do 99% of SWE jobs offers seem completely pointless?

#160
I read Cal Newport's "So Good They Can't Ignore You" (https://www.calnewport.com/books/so-good/) when I was around the college age, which helped me solidify a belief I always had in the back of my mind: Work isn't about finding something you enjoy, it's about finding something you're good at.

I think there's a whole sub-conversation to be had about how work is perceived in different cultures. It seems to me like Americans are much to focused on what you're describing, which is that work has to be pleasurable. In my eastern European family, there was never any doubt: Work is about making sure you have food on the table, and a roof over your head.

That's not to say I'd take any job, if I was morally opposed to the work (See: Working at F̶a̶c̶e̶b̶o̶o̶k̶ Meta) I'd go elsewhere. But not being in love with my work is fine. I don't hate it, I'm just indifferent to it, and it funds my actual life outside of work.

As for not wanting to off myself? I think that comes back to that cultural aspect. I could never imagine wanting to end my life just because my job isn't amazing, because I never had a preconception that it could be. I don't feel like I'm "missing" anything by not loving my job, because I love my life.

Post reply on HN