Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#151

Post by frizkie » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:09 AM UTC

tashoecraft wrote: post #31

martinesko36 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm almost certain I'd never do an internship. It's not a way to optimize for learning and personal growth. And definitely not a whiteboard generic software engineering. Lots of things about internships in the tech field put me off. If it is a startup, I have had a startup, high chance it's a shitshow. FAANG, don't think so. Also what meaningful work can you really get done in 3 months? I feel like internships are a…

It’s partly about working in a professional environment. You can get a 4 year degree and never use git, never work on a single codebase that has existed long before you came and will exist long after you leave. There is so much experience from just working in a professional setting that can greatly boost your resume. We take caution hiring people without this experience as it can be impossible to teach this to someon…

> You can get a 4 year degree and never use git

Having graduated about a year ago, this is the craziest thing I noticed about so many of my classmates. It'll be trial by fire for sure.

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#152

Post by heartbreak » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:15 AM UTC

malvosenior wrote: post #100

commandlinefan wrote: post #80

I’ve been thinking about that a lot myself for a few years now, since my 16-year-old son is talking about majoring in CS when he gets into college in a couple of years - he’s even optimizing his high school courses to maximize his chances of getting into a good program in a good school. Having worked as a programmer now for nearly 30 years, I see programming devolving as a career more and more every year: now we have…

It's pretty much always been that way though. Death March was written 20 years ago: https://www.amazon.com/Death-March-Developers-Surviving-Impo... I'd say the demand for programmers is higher than ever and pay is definitely higher overall. 20 years ago $150k was a good salary for a programmer, now it's more like $350k.

> 20 years ago $150k was a good salary for a programmer, now it's more like $350k.

That’s $50k and $150k for those of us who don’t live in SV.

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#153

Post by phkahler » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:16 AM UTC

patorjk wrote: post #90

> honestly makes me worried about the future of the field in terms of whether it'll still be a good career in the future. I had the same thoughts back in the late 90's and early 00's. Everytime I told someone I was interested in CS, they thought it was because of the money. While working on the major many people told me my job was going to go overseas and that the future was in managing developers. In fact, during my…

>> While working on the major many people told me my job was going to go overseas and that the future was in managing developers.

I had a friend in the 90s tell me the entire workforce in the US was shifting to management. Everything will be outsourced and people here will just manage everything. This was an MIS major drinking the business school koolaid. I thought it was rather arrogant to think China or India could build anything under the sun but wouldn't be able to manage people and run a business...

20 years later many the companies that followed such thinking are gone or having problems.

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#154

Post by to1y » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:17 AM UTC

briga wrote: post #122

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> IMO blue collar work is a better option because it's easier work and-- Your opinion is wrong. Programming gigs, especially at the giant tech companies, are way, way easier than blue collar work. Blue collar work, especially skilled trade work, is a fine career option, but not because it's easy.

Programming and blue collar work are two different types of work, requiring different skill-sets that not everyone has. Ask your average construction worker to write a web app and no doubt they would find it very difficult. Ask your average programmer to build a house and they would also find it challenging. Both types of work can be exhausting, it's just that one is mentally exhausting and the other is physically ex…

Difference is you can learn everything you need to build a house in a week. You'll make a couple mistakes, you might be off by a little bit, but it really is a lot simpler than the layman thinks. Personally I have found repetitive, physically straining work to be extremely mentally exhausting but in a worse way; There are next to no challenging problems but you are forced to keep your mind on the task with all sorts of pains and aches. At the end of the day though it's a lot easier to walk away from your work, and you know you've always got a job.

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#155

Post by TrackerFF » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:17 AM UTC

The thing with tech is that, I think you need some passion for the trade, in order to make it any longer than a couple of years.

Doing something you hate, even if it pays well, becomes a drag real quick. Before you know it, you're hitting up your network, trying to get _something_ more interesting.

I think most people will hit a point in their mid/late 20s, where they think hard and long "Is this what I want to do for the rest of my life?".

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#156

Post by crimsonalucard » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:23 AM UTC

mind-blight wrote: post #9

The supply of jobs is still way above the available workers. A lot of people conflate coding jobs with valley, FAANG, or startup jobs. The reality is that every industry, institution, and every company is in the process of migrating their business practices and operations to be digital. I think coding is going to become more common place in every business, including the small ones. Software development may eventually…

Yes but anecdotally I think the supply is accelerating faster than demand.

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#157

Post by TrackerFF » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:25 AM UTC

thorwasdfasdf wrote: post #41

If you're from an elite university, then you'll have a good chance of getting into a FANG. A SE at a FANG will make triple as much as a SE for most other companies, so do try your best to get into a FANG. If you're smart, You might be able to earn 400K or more in just 5 to 8 years. However, if you don't get into a FANG, it's not the end of the world. You might still be able to find another job at another software com…

What's the average tenure at FAANG these days, 2-4 years?

To stay in the upper income-bracket, you'll also need to be where the money is. And I'm sure you can count on one hand all the areas where you'll get a mid six-figure salary.

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#158

Post by TrackerFF » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:32 AM UTC

d-d wrote: post #91

Unpopular opinion: it's not a good career unless you are the best of the best. IMO blue collar work is a better option because it's easier work and more stable, and lets you have a life outside work. In software the hours are increasing to no real benefit, and free time is burnt just keeping with the times. The evolution of tools, best practices and high availability of quality knowledge has made it trivial to spin u…

Before, and during my college years, I worked some pretty gnarly manual labor jobs. From decent blue-collar trade jobs, to downright digging ditches, longshoreman, to a gopher on construction sites.

I can tell you this, there were some recurring themes at those places:

- Injuries

- Work never stops, no mater what weather

- People in their 30s getting college degrees because that's the only way to get promoted in a company, unless your manager just happens to kneel over in the near future.

- Constant stress of getting contracts. Blue-collar work can be extremely seasonal.

- Did I say injuries? Yeah. Stress injuries will start popping up sooner or later. I don't know a single electrician or plumber that hasn't had some type of injury related to their working positions (shoulders, neck, arms,etc.)

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#159

Post by knr2345 » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:37 AM UTC

christiansakai wrote: post #142

I graduated from a programming bootcamp about 6 years ago. I decided to go into full CS degree but my bootcamp instructors said to me "it is a waste of time and will cost you a lot of opportunity cost". A lot of my friends from that bootcamp without CS degree already have good careers as engineering managers, senior staff software engineers at startups, or regular engineers (around junior and mid level) at Facebook/G…

Your comment resonated with me. Sounds strange, but - any advice on finding a worthwhile bootcamp?

I'm in in the middle of a career-transition effort myself. I'm a ChemEng & do fine financially so the motivation is not money-based. Honestly though, the faster I can switch the better.

I completed a Graduation CS Foundations program (5 courses at Master's level university credit) and now I'm starting a Master's CS program.

I originally explored bootcamps but my impression (purely online based, no friends in the industry) was that it could be hit or miss and all were not created equal. Plus, the cost seemed high compared to other options. The online research leaned a bit more to the doom & gloom side but I figured reality was closer to neutral.

At this point though, I'm exploring all options to make the move as soon as possible so curious if a bootcamp might help speed up the process. The MS program will take 2-3 years since I will be working full-time in my current position (which I plan to complete regardless). I'd really prefer that my after-work efforts be more closely tied to my day job as I continue with such a workload the next couple years (not to mention the synergistic benefits).

Re: Ask HN: CS, still a good career in 3-5 years?

#160

Post by MaximumYComb » Wed, Dec 18, 2019, 2:39 AM UTC

leetrout wrote: post #143

JimboOmega wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was basically born into CS; there was no question even from Kindergarten that I would ever go into another field. Got my first real full time job at 25, and it was mediocre, it was definitely not a FAANG paradise, and I remember we worried a lot about getting off-shored in those days. I'm really glad the thing I was naturally interested in turned out to pay so well. Though I do wonder what do I (as an SF dev) offer…

I look at my skills compared to the earning potential of some other trades. This is certainly not 100% accurate because it’s based on what I pay in more rural America but I like it: Barber - 3 cuts per hour @ $20 ea = $60 / hour Mechanic - $60-80 per hour Lawn Care - $40 / yard up to 3-4 yards per hour = $40-$120 per hour Steam cleaning = $150 for a couch = $150 per hour (carpets are less) Plumbers in East Tennessee…

As a general rule, the jobs you listed aren't making $120k+. The ones that make that money are working long hours with poor conditions. Developers making $120k are very privileged compared to labour roles