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Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

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Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#151

Post by adrianN »

erklik wrote: post #128
nitwit005 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on my father and grandmother's interactions, suggesting they call if ever in doubt can be a big help. What saved her from the fake Microsoft support scam was her calling him to ask if she should go to someone cheaper to help with the non-existant issue. Offering to do her taxes prevented some other scam. Although that did require flying out annually due to being so disorganized.

> Based on my father and grandmother's interactions, suggesting they call if ever in doubt can be a big help. However, do understand, that this can lead to the opposite effect of constantly calling on every little thing leading to them becoming even more dependent on you.

Better dependent on you than losing their life savings to a scammer.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#152

Post by m12k »

agf wrote: post #21

The number one thing you can do to help them is talk to them about being conned / scammed. That's by far the most likely way for them to get victimized online, and the only way that's seriously affected anyone I know. Since they're not technical, their natural self-defense against this kind of this has trouble functioning online. Talk to them about real world analogs to pop-up ads that look like virus scanner alerts,…

Also, tell them to be suspicious of email links that require them to log in. If "PayPal" sends an email saying you need to change your password or log in for some other reason, teach them to go to type paypal.com in the browser themselves instead of clicking the link.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#153

Post by markvdb »

mceachen wrote: post #110
bradleyankrom wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Advice I could have used five years ago. I don’t even know how to talk to my parents about current events/politics now because we don’t share a common base of facts.

Perhaps broach the fact that social networks are really just advertisement delivery networks, and that they found that partitioning audiences by interests let them sell you for more money. Try opening an incognito tab and search for flat earth on youtube, and then see what videos that window gets recommended, if they don't believe you.

One usually _wants_ to stay where one feels comfortable. Human nature. Whether one realises one's in a bubble will only rarely change that.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#154

Post by pasabagi »

johnchristopher wrote: post #60
dontbenebby wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think part of the problem is rote memorization rather than learning concepts. (Eg: maybe if someone learns about the context of a "task switcher" and "shortcut" they could be taught how to search for 'task switcher shortcut windows'. Instead we train users to treat keyboard shortcuts like magical incantations. I don't think that does a service to users of any age.

She's a knowledge worker, highly paid and was in her 20's when computers became ubiquitous. Her education, the job she's supposed to do... it's like a carpenter who don't want to learn about electric screwdrivers. As soon as you try to get a bit more general: “Ctrl-A works in any applications or folders or anything with multiple items... it allows you to select everything at once.” She shuts down and gets back to her…

>The thing is: computers aren't magical enough yet for that kind of user.

Isn't it the other way around? Ctrl+A does nothing on my machine, because I haven't set it up to do anything.

I think the problem is that most OS's were designed with programmers in mind, then have had a kind of 'user-friendly' face lift pasted over fundamentals that have remained more or less the same. I can see why non-computer people don't want to deal with that - you engage most of the time with the user-friendly mask, but it's fundamentally incoherent and inconsistent, since it's just a mask, implemented half-heartedly, by programmers who don't use it.

Ctrl+A is basically just an incantation. When people are presented by a bunch of incantations with no logical consistency, by a machine they aren't interested in, it's unsurprising they learn the bare minimum.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#155

Post by Consultant32452 »

bradleyankrom wrote: post #22
PakG1 wrote: post #14

Honestly, while getting phished and hacked are big issues, I would also worry about them being sucked into social media bubbles where they could start latching onto conspiracy theories, fake news, and the like. It was not too long ago where their generation believed it was a bad idea to believe anything on the Internet. I'm not sure what changed. I have seen my own parents fall suspect to that stuff now and then, so…

Advice I could have used five years ago. I don’t even know how to talk to my parents about current events/politics now because we don’t share a common base of facts.

The hardest part of broaching this problem is learning to accept that, as a percentage, you're probably just as wrong about the facts as your parents are. Everyone likes to think that it's only "those people" who are foolish, subject to conspiracy, or other negative descriptors. Statistically, that's just not realistic. And even if you're 100% right, approaching people with the humbleness of assuming you're 80% wrong will allow you to have better conversations.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#156

Post by yakshaving_jgt »

Everyone should educate their parents (and themselves) on the dangers of Multi-Level Marketing. One of my parents very nearly got sucked into a MLM scheme, and the most painful thing is if you say it's a bad idea, they assume you mean that the MLM system is fine and that they are just not smart/dedicated enough to be successful.

There was a good Penn & Teller: Bullshit! episode on this, called 'Easy Money'.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#157

Post by iforgotpassword »

xhrpost wrote: post #134

This just almost happened to me and my family. My parents are pushing 70 but still try to keep up with things. My father decides he wants to call PayPal regarding a return request from eBay. I'm in the room and "PayPal" tells him they need to go to a secure line and he needs to download an app. That's really strange I think, but generally scams are from phone calls to you, not you making the call. So I remain skeptic…

Babysit them more. Locked down account so they can't install stuff, better yet Linux so random stuff from the internet or malicious email attachment have a very high chance of not being for their platform.

And then just train them to forward any email that they can't identify as scam themselves right away to you.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#158

Post by MandieD »

PakG1 wrote: post #14

Honestly, while getting phished and hacked are big issues, I would also worry about them being sucked into social media bubbles where they could start latching onto conspiracy theories, fake news, and the like. It was not too long ago where their generation believed it was a bad idea to believe anything on the Internet. I'm not sure what changed. I have seen my own parents fall suspect to that stuff now and then, so…

The difference that social media has made is that now their good friend/favorite cousin is saying the thing, not some random person on the Internet, even if it is something some random person on the Internet originally said for whatever nefarious purpose.

Re: Ask HN: How do I make sure my non-technical parents are safe online?

#159

Post by shstalwart »

patch_collector wrote: post #144
maxxxxx wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would hope that my parents could tell me from another caller :-)

I believe the standard strategy here is to say you've been in an accident, you're in the hospital while traveling, your jaw was broken, and that's why you sound different. Or you're having the nurse call them. Something to explain why your voice isn't what they expect.

This happened to my grandmother a few years ago, with somebody claiming to be me. Purportedly, I had broken my arm in Spain, and needed money for surgery. Fortunately, she had the good sense to call my parents and find out if I was actually in Spain.
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